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Ultimate Nate Oats Thread - Future/Staying/Growth/Articles

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1 minute ago, dutchcountry7 said:

No.

Gonzaga made the Elite 8 in the 90s.

And the 90s are 20 years ago now...

Their first Elite 8 appearance was 1999...their first season under Mark Few.  After all the build up of the 90s they finally broke through.  Wouldn't you agree that its similar to how we are building?

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Comparison not bad...

Looking at Gonzaga starting with the last time they went NCAA before this current blue blood streak of 20 straight years in the NCAA...

1994-95 NCAA round of 64
95-96 NIT
96-97 no tourney
97-98 NIT
98-99 NCAA Elite 8
Overall: 109-47 (69.9%) Conf: 47-23 (67.1%)

Coach 1, was there for the first 3 years (the end of a 12 year stint)
Coach 2 was there for the final 2 years (leaving after 2 years)

UB last 5 years

NCAA round of 64
NCAA round of 64
no tourney
NCAA round of 32
NCAA likely
Overall 103-50 (67.3%) Conference 52-24 (68.4%)

Coach 1 was there for the first year, (the end of a 2 year stint)
Coach 2 was there for the final four years (TBD)

****
In the next 5 years at Gonzaga, Coach 3 (Few) took over they went
99-00 NCAA sweet 16
00-01 NCAA sweet 16
01-02 NCAA round of 64
02-03 NCAA round of 32
03-04 NCAA round of 32
Overall 133-32 (80.6%) Conf 62-8 (88.6%)
 

From 05 - present, they have retained Few, he's won 82.3% overall and  89.8% in conference and have not missed the NCAA Tourney..

 

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I'm also reading the Zags increased ticket revenue by 400% once they went to their new building.

They went from 4000 seats selling for a total of about $89/season to 6000 seats selling for a total of about $240/season.

Our demand hasn't reached that level yet, sadly, I thought we would sell out every game this year

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48 minutes ago, DooleyBull06 said:

Exaclty! It didn't happen over night.  That is my point.  The parallel is that we are currently where Gonzaga was in the 90s.  And if Oats stays we can get to where Gonzaga was in the 2000s and eventually to where they are now.  If Oats stays I feel it can happen quicker bc the landscape is different than it was then.

It’s way too early to say we’re where Gonzaga was in the 90s - you can only tell that after the fact. 😉 they were building and transitioning; we hope that’s where we are, but we may be just having some fluke years, and may end up lucky to have anything resembling the success of Kent State for a couple years, nevermind being Gonzaga East. 

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48 minutes ago, DooleyBull06 said:

Exaclty! It didn't happen over night.  That is my point.  The parallel is that we are currently where Gonzaga was in the 90s.  And if Oats stays we can get to where Gonzaga was in the 2000s and eventually to where they are now.  If Oats stays I feel it can happen quicker bc the landscape is different than it was then.

It’s way too early to say we’re where Gonzaga was in the 90s - you can only tell that after the fact. 😉 they were building and transitioning; we hope that’s where we are, but we may be just having some fluke years, and may end up lucky to have anything resembling the success of Kent State for a couple years, nevermind being Gonzaga East. 

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I think we can say we are where Gonzaga was in the 90's. But we don't know if we will convert that success into sustained and profitable success the way Gonzaga has.

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1 hour ago, DooleyBull06 said:

Their first Elite 8 appearance was 1999...their first season under Mark Few.  After all the build up of the 90s they finally broke through.  Wouldn't you agree that its similar to how we are building?

This has been said by many different programs. 

As much as I like all the UB bids, the school has never been an atlarge program until this year  

Until the program reloads, I would not draw any comparison to Gonzaga. 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said:

Many programs have been where Gonzaga was in the 90s. Few programs have been where Gonzaga is. 

gotta crawl, walk, then run

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31 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said:

Many programs have been where Gonzaga was in the 90s. Few programs have been where Gonzaga is. 

I make the distinction, because you need a foundation. I put the numbers up to show our foundation is about the same as Gonzaga's foundation.

Then you need to build on that. Then you need to maintain it and keep up with your new peers.

The question of this thread is what does UB do next to keep that Gonzaga progress...that's what the fans want, and probably is what would keep Oats around.

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I'll add this to the Gonzaga Comparison...

It took the Zags 9 years to receive an At-Large bid and in this run they have 4 total At-large bids over this 25 year run.

A major part of that is that they've only lost the conference tournament 7 times in 25 years.

Edited by bull_trojan

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Progress on facilities and salary are important. Attendance and fan support also important. We can talk about comparisons all we want. The fact of the matter Nate believes he can create a Gonzaga type program in Buffalo. His wife Crystal also believes that. The thought appeals to them both. They love Buffalo. They love their home. Their three girls are fully integrated into this community. They have a multitude of friends. 

While that is all fact it doesn’t mean if he’s hit with an offer that blows him away he’ll stay. But unlike Hurley he’s not antsy to move. Regardless I’d be the first to wish him well if he gets that “blow away offer” and chooses to accept it. He’s done tremendous things here. He is a class act through and through. He is light years ahead of Hurley as a coach. 

Lastly it is true that few, like Mark Few, will stay at a mid when an offer of 2M or so comes their way. Nevertheless I’d put my money on him staying for many of the pro-stay reasons mentioned by others here. 

Go Bulls! Let’s keep it going next week!

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2 hours ago, UB85 said:

Progress on facilities and salary are important. Attendance and fan support also important. We can talk about comparisons all we want. The fact of the matter Nate believes he can create a Gonzaga type program in Buffalo. His wife Crystal also believes that. The thought appeals to them both. They love Buffalo. They love their home. Their three girls are fully integrated into this community. They have a multitude of friends. 

While that is all fact it doesn’t mean if he’s hit with an offer that blows him away he’ll stay. But unlike Hurley he’s not antsy to move. Regardless I’d be the first to wish him well if he gets that “blow away offer” and chooses to accept it. He’s done tremendous things here. He is a class act through and through. He is light years ahead of Hurley as a coach. 

Lastly it is true that few, like Mark Few, will stay at a mid when an offer of 2M or so comes their way. Nevertheless I’d put my money on him staying for many of the pro-stay reasons mentioned by others here. 

Go Bulls! Let’s keep it going next week!

I hope you are right.

Media (and others) compare everyone to Gonzaga because they are the gold standard.  It is what the media does.    Also...the media need to write stories to attract interest.  UB is the golden child for that this year. I mean, how many articles can you write about Zion?  This year Buffalo (and in every other year there is some other team/teams for a diversion) is the one.  Lots of media surrounding Buffalo and it will only grow as the team keeps winning and is strongly ranked.  All good.  I am in it for the long game.  In my mind, every article on the Athletic, or the AP or Yahoo or ESPN.com brings us incrementally closer to moving to a high conference.  To me -- that's where I think UB needs to go.  While I would prefer we skip the AAC, it would be a good step (of course, I want B1G....UB, by many factors -- though not all -- is a B1G school --- but that is for another thread).

At any rate, I believe we can think long term and act short term.  In the short term...we need to keep up the momentum of football and basketball (having the success that WBB has had only enhances the package -- it is all good).  Right now...we need to keep Oats in the fold.

Does anyone have a list of MAC coaches' salary?  That would be a good start.  You would think he'd need to be top salary as an opener.

 

 

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3 hours ago, UB92 said:

how many articles can you write about Zion?

Don't tempt ESPN

MAC salaries, most from last year (base salary, total comp - Ohio coaches):

Keith Dambrot, Akron - $932,071

John Groce, Akron - $650,000**

Saul Phillips, Ohio - $623,329

Nate Oats, Buffalo - $600,000

Rob Senderoff, Kent State - $497,661

Tod Kowalczyk, Toledo - $487,201

Michael Huger, Bowling Green - $449,078

Steve Hawkins, WMU - $385,000

John Cooper, Miami - $358,622

Mark Montgomery, NIU - $316,140

Keno Davis, CMU - $300,000

James Whitford, Ball State - $286,083

Rob Murphy, EMU - $235,000

**Groce makes $350k from Akron $300k from Illinois, but his salary jumps when UI stops paying him

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3 hours ago, rma said:

Don't tempt ESPN

MAC salaries, most from last year (base salary, total comp - Ohio coaches):

Keith Dambrot, Akron - $932,071

John Groce, Akron - $650,000**

Saul Phillips, Ohio - $623,329

Nate Oats, Buffalo - $600,000

Rob Senderoff, Kent State - $497,661

Tod Kowalczyk, Toledo - $487,201

Michael Huger, Bowling Green - $449,078

Steve Hawkins, WMU - $385,000

John Cooper, Miami - $358,622

Mark Montgomery, NIU - $316,140

Keno Davis, CMU - $300,000

James Whitford, Ball State - $286,083

Rob Murphy, EMU - $235,000

**Groce makes $350k from Akron $300k from Illinois, but his salary jumps when UI stops paying him

Thanks.  

It would seem that somewhere in the $800k range (+/-) as base would be the starting point.  I mean, you kind of have to do that without it even being a negotiation point to demonstrate value.

I wonder if Groce's salary will still be $650k once the Illinois part runs out.  It is Akron, so you never know.  They just gave a guy with very limited credentials a strong salary to replace Bowden (who, I assume, they still have to pay for a few years).

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$400k base, $250k in "supplemental compensation" after the UI part runs out.

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How can we compare UB to Gonzaga? It’s absurd. Look at next year. I don’t care who is coaching the team, UB is losing Perkins, Massinburg, Harris, Caruthers, and McRae: 62 points per game. Plus the defense that they give. And the leadership. Who will pick up the slack? I like Graves - he’s athletic and can shoot from three and get to the rim. I love Jordan - he’s a defensive stud and a real team player, but not a real scorer. Now we get to the current freshmen: Segu, Williams, and Fagan.

Segu is quick but short and light. Not much to go on so far from his body of work, but like his hustle and looking for the open man.

Williams is a rangy and raw talent. He’s got to be reigned in though. He’s a shoot first guy and when you’re 2 / 31 from three that’s bad. Too early to see what type of defense he’ll provide, but I haven’t been impressed.

Fagan - just have no idea.

The transfers and JCs: ?

Does anyone really think that the Bulls will dominate the MAC next year? If Oats remains to coach next year, they have a slim chance of returning to the dance. If Oats gets hired by one of the big boys for big bucks, God help his successor.

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16 minutes ago, squire17 said:

How can we compare UB to Gonzaga? It’s absurd. Look at next year. I don’t care who is coaching the team, UB is losing Perkins, Massinburg, Harris, Caruthers, and McRae: 62 points per game. Plus the defense that they give. And the leadership. Who will pick up the slack? I like Graves - he’s athletic and can shoot from three and get to the rim. I love Jordan - he’s a defensive stud and a real team player, but not a real scorer. Now we get to the current freshmen: Segu, Williams, and Fagan.

Segu is quick but short and light. Not much to go on so far from his body of work, but like his hustle and looking for the open man.

Williams is a rangy and raw talent. He’s got to be reigned in though. He’s a shoot first guy and when you’re 2 / 31 from three that’s bad. Too early to see what type of defense he’ll provide, but I haven’t been impressed.

Fagan - just have no idea.

The transfers and JCs: ?

Does anyone really think that the Bulls will dominate the MAC next year? If Oats remains to coach next year, they have a slim chance of returning to the dance. If Oats gets hired by one of the big boys for big bucks, God help his successor.

The returnees are good, 4 of whom are either playing big minutes this year or highly touted youngsters, who will have 1 full year of experience having practiced with and against a ranked team. The 2 senior transfers will provide instant experience. A couple of the JuCo guys have size and can provide some depth to the position. Do we think they'll as good as this year's team? It's hard for anyone to think that, but there's no reason to think that they aren't top end of the MAC with the current coaching staff in place.

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6 minutes ago, squire17 said:

How can we compare UB to Gonzaga? It’s absurd. Look at next year. I don’t care who is coaching the team, UB is losing Perkins, Massinburg, Harris, Caruthers, and McRae: 62 points per game. Plus the defense that they give. And the leadership. Who will pick up the slack? I like Graves - he’s athletic and can shoot from three and get to the rim. I love Jordan - he’s a defensive stud and a real team player, but not a real scorer. Now we get to the current freshmen: Segu, Williams, and Fagan.

Segu is quick but short and light. Not much to go on so far from his body of work, but like his hustle and looking for the open man.

Williams is a rangy and raw talent. He’s got to be reigned in though. He’s a shoot first guy and when you’re 2 / 31 from three that’s bad. Too early to see what type of defense he’ll provide, but I haven’t been impressed.

Fagan - just have no idea.

The transfers and JCs: ?

Does anyone really think that the Bulls will dominate the MAC next year? If Oats remains to coach next year, they have a slim chance of returning to the dance. If Oats gets hired by one of the big boys for big bucks, God help his successor.

Obviously our future success depends on Oats staying.  Obviously next year will be a "down year" by comparison to this season.  But there is one big thing we must remember...if we can win 3 or 4 straight games in the MAC tourney we go dancing.  So in a way we control our destiny, always.  Next season will be about testing ourselves in the non conference, again, and building for the MAC tourney. But as long as Oats is here its all about building the program into a mid major power like a Gonzaga.  We aren't comparable to Gonzaga as they currently are but if you go back in time and review how they came up the comparison is valid. The trajectory of the rise of the programs are similar in terms of winning conferences, making the NCAAs, gaining notoriety and pulling some upsets. And if Oats takes a page from Mark Few and stays then over the course of next 10 years hopefully we can have continued top 25 success like a Gonzaga.

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2 hours ago, DooleyBull06 said:
2 hours ago, DooleyBull06 said:

Obviously our future success depends on Oats staying.  Obviously next year will be a "down year" by comparison to this season.  But there is one big thing we must remember...if we can win 3 or 4 straight games in the MAC tourney we go dancing.  So in a way we control our destiny, always.  Next season will be about testing ourselves in the non conference, again, and building for the MAC tourney. But as long as Oats is here its all about building the program into a mid major power like a Gonzaga.  We aren't comparable to Gonzaga as they currently are but if you go back in time and review how they came up the comparison is valid. The trajectory of the rise of the programs are similar in terms of winning conferences, making the NCAAs, gaining notoriety and pulling some upsets. And if Oats takes a page from Mark Few and stays then over the course of next 10 years hopefully we can have continued top 25 success like a Gonzaga.

Gonzaga has won 518 games since the 2001-2002 season. They have danced every year. It’s my opinion that they have been over-rated in many of those seasons as evidenced by their early bails in the NCAAs. Still, that is a model of consistent standing. Oats is doing a fabulous job at UB and I’m not alone in hoping that he stays and continues to bolster the program. Let’s wait a few years before we compare UB to Gonzaga.

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7 minutes ago, squire17 said:

Gonzaga has won 518 games since the 2001-2002 season. They have danced every year. It’s my opinion that they have been over-rated in many of those seasons as evidenced by their early bails in the NCAAs. Still, that is a model of consistent standing. Oats is doing a fabulous job at UB and I’m not alone in hoping that he stays and continues to bolster the program. Let’s wait a few years before we compare UB to Gonzaga.

I agree with you that Gonzaga has been over rated.  No argument there.  And I definitely agree that I hope Oats stays and continues to bolster the program.  But again...I'm comparing us to the 1990s Gonzaga build up.  Similar build up.  Similar in that we had a coach leave for "greener pastures".  Similar that we now have a young hot commodity head coach.  Lots of similarities.  What I am not saying is that we are on 2018-19 Gonzaga level. Nor am I saying that we have had the consistent period of sustained success as Gonzaga from 2000 on.

This may be our peak, who knows.  But as long as Oats is here I'm confident that in our down cycle we will still contend for MAC titles and in our up cycles we can do big time damage.

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It is being reported that Lance’s contract has been extended 5 years and he’s getting paid 615k. Congrats to Lance. And I suspect that’s a good move. It does beg the question though if Lance is getting 615k should not Nate given his far superior record of success get substantially more? 

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