squire17 Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 If the football team is bringing home the bacon, then it would be irrational to downgrade the program. Or so the theory of the apologists goes. The only catch is that football doesn’t make money - it loses money. But, we are told, the football program gets paid $50 million to play at Notre Dame! So what, if your outlay is $60 million to play? Okay. I get it: At this level every sport is a money loser. I can live with that because of the extraneous benefits that accrue to the University for having a vigorous and competitive intercollegiate program over a wide breadth of teams. Here’s what sticks in my craw. Telling us that football brings in the money. Bullshit! It loses money! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire17 Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 8 hours ago, bull_trojan said: Football attendance 2018: 110,280. Basketball attendance 2018-19: 74,054 Perhaps. I was at most of the basketball games. An average of roughly 5200 is easily believable. Pretty remarkable considering the fact that several games took place when school was not in session. Football? Watched many games on TV. Hard to believe the average of roughly 18000...it looked as though there were very few fans at some games. Stands looked EMPTY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull_trojan Posted March 11, 2019 Author Share Posted March 11, 2019 While this has veered into a convo about investment it is interesting that it took Gonzaga 10 years and 24 years to invest in upgrades to their facilities. Few only makes 1.4 million/year. so Gonzaga didn’t do it by throwing money at it... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DooleyBull06 Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 People keep talking about about money for Oats in the range of 1.2 to 1.5 million. Especially from a P5 institution. If he already makes 600k the difference is from 600k to 1.2 is 600k. So really the question is will Oats walk away for 600k? Furthermore if we give him a raise of 200k or 300k bringing his total to 800-900k then the question is will he walk away for for that extra 300-400k? I’m not saying it’s chunp change, but is that enough to make Nate bounce. And leave everything he’s built here on and off the court. Enough to bounce and take a great recruiting class with him? I think the addition of Williams and potential Hawkings make staying a more compelling option and becoming the Gonzaga of the East. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 13 hours ago, rma said: I could reiterate the numbers that Bull Run has posted numerous times. However think of it like this. In the past 10 years, 12 teams have joined FBS football. One has moved down to FCS (which kinda made sense given their travel situation). There must be some value to FBS football especially in a conference as geographically small as ours. I'm not saying that it makes money, but rather there is marketing/brand value in a D1 FBS football program. Maybe we can’t make comparisons about the football program if it is like trying to compare apples and orange. Maybe you can’t compare college football to running a business. If a business continues to lose money and their capital dries up are they able to stay in business?? For a football program that is losing money to stay in business because it is a good marketing brand in D1 does not make sense. But as long as UB is getting the money from somewhere even if they are losing money overall they will continue this path. I am sure it is like this in many colleges all over the country. As far as attendance those figures I believe are paid attendance figures not fans that actually attend the games. Their were many games where there were only a couple thousand in attendance. Will continue to support our team and hope more success next year. Go Bulls!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UB_Prush Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 1 hour ago, DooleyBull06 said: People keep talking about about money for Oats in the range of 1.2 to 1.5 million. Especially from a P5 institution. If he already makes 600k the difference is from 600k to 1.2 is 600k. So really the question is will Oats walk away for 600k? Furthermore if we give him a raise of 200k or 300k bringing his total to 800-900k then the question is will he walk away for for that extra 300-400k? I’m not saying it’s chunp change, but is that enough to make Nate bounce. And leave everything he’s built here on and off the court. Enough to bounce and take a great recruiting class with him? I think the addition of Williams and potential Hawkings make staying a more compelling option and becoming the Gonzaga of the East. I don't know what the number is for him to bounce, but anything less than him being the highest paid coach in the MAC should come as motivation to do so. Aside from that caveat I don't think he wants to chase the money and would be fine here as long we show him that respect and the support to upgrade practice facilities. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillenniumBull Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 So this field house. I have been to a Siena game at the Times Union Center on a Friday night, then attended a Minor League Hockey game on a Saturday afternoon. Why can’t it house a few practice courts in the winter until a rec center is built? Are we planning on just turning the heat/lights off after January? Can the football team even practice off season? These are not schools/organizations with huge budgets and they make it work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promotherobot Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 On 3/10/2019 at 12:17 PM, DooleyBull06 said: UB is a basketball school. But football will always lead the way. Bc football is where the money is. So if it doesn’t make sense for football isn’t doesn’t make sense for the school. Which is why we have to table talks about conference realignment. And open talks about the things that could keep Oats here. Things like raises for him and the staff. New practice facility. Things that provide stability and growth of a program. We make these upgrades we can make it enticing to keep Nate and bring in recruits and keep winning. All the while hopefully the football team continues their rise and wins the conference and bowl games and bring in dollars. Only when the stars align for football will things come to a head. But until then we have to do everything to keep the recent success of our football and basketball programs going. That all said we are closer to a championship in basketball than we are in football. But we can ever scrap or turn our backs on football. They have to work in concert. See what UCF is doing. Speaking of UCF, they may create our opening in the AAC when they move to the Big 12. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rma Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 2 hours ago, MillenniumBull said: So this field house. I have been to a Siena game at the Times Union Center on a Friday night, then attended a Minor League Hockey game on a Saturday afternoon. Why can’t it house a few practice courts in the winter until a rec center is built? Are we planning on just turning the heat/lights off after January? Can the football team even practice off season? These are not schools/organizations with huge budgets and they make it work. I imagine that there is a decent amount of overlap between football practice and basketball practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skrabukes Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 2 hours ago, MillenniumBull said: So this field house. I have been to a Siena game at the Times Union Center on a Friday night, then attended a Minor League Hockey game on a Saturday afternoon. Why can’t it house a few practice courts in the winter until a rec center is built? Are we planning on just turning the heat/lights off after January? Can the football team even practice off season? These are not schools/organizations with huge budgets and they make it work. The track team will be using it, as will soccer and softball, I assume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UB92 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 hour ago, promotherobot said: Speaking of UCF, they may create our opening in the AAC when they move to the Big 12. True. Danny White may be all "P6 AAC", but once he gets into a P5 (and it is only time...UCF is huge), White will be all "new conference, who dis?" when the G5 asks for his support. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChubbyHubby Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 hour ago, UB92 said: True. Danny White may be all "P6 AAC", but once he gets into a P5 (and it is only time...UCF is huge), White will be all "new conference, who dis?" when the G5 asks for his support. Kinda like the way he was at UB if he wasn't the one that hired you. Or, if you didn't have deep pockets. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promotherobot Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 10 hours ago, UB92 said: True. Danny White may be all "P6 AAC", but once he gets into a P5 (and it is only time...UCF is huge), White will be all "new conference, who dis?" when the G5 asks for his support. 9 hours ago, ChubbyHubby said: Kinda like the way he was at UB if he wasn't the one that hired you. Or, if you didn't have deep pockets. College athletics are ruthless. But UB is where it is now thanks to him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChubbyHubby Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 5 hours ago, promotherobot said: College athletics are ruthless. But UB is where it is now thanks to him. You can be ruthless without being a dick to those that are working for the same team you are. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillenniumBull Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 17 hours ago, skrabukes said: The track team will be using it, as will soccer and softball, I assume. Can’t these teams train by playing basketball? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DooleyBull06 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 33 minutes ago, MillenniumBull said: Can’t these teams train by playing basketball? They might pull a groin having to make sharp cuts lol Edited March 12, 2019 by DooleyBull06 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubmae86 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 I don't want to detail the Bulls board right now, but I'd anyone watching SMU vs Gonzaga. I hope Nate is recording this in case we face them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UB92 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 10 hours ago, ubmae86 said: I don't want to detail the Bulls board right now, but I'd anyone watching SMU vs Gonzaga. I hope Nate is recording this in case we face them This game must have been very distracting!! I had to read your post several times to figure it out... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutchcountry7 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 On 3/10/2019 at 2:53 PM, rma said: Dropping football would case huge title IX problems too. No it wouldn't. The problem would be that UB would be kicked out of the MAC and not have a viable home. Who would take the Bulls? I don't see the A10 offering an invite. Horizon league? That's a drop in conference. America East? That has some good teams but would just put all the SUNY schools together. That does nothing to help UB standout... There is no other conference that is a good fit. The MAC is a great fit. Has some good basketball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rma Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 38 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said: No it wouldn't. How would we allocate scholarships then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutchcountry7 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 (edited) 35 minutes ago, rma said: How would we allocate scholarships then? You could also add a men's team, like LAX, that is a fraction of the cost of football to get the minimum number of sports. You cut football and add LAX and you have a huge cost savings and now you can pay Oats $2.5 Million a year. It gives you a lot more options if you cut football. But they aren't cutting football. It is important to remember that not every sport give the full allotment of scholarships. They could give more scholarships to the teams that remain. Edited March 13, 2019 by dutchcountry7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGBull Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said: You could also add a men's team, like LAX, that is a fraction of the cost of football to get the minimum number of sports and allow for more women's scholarships. You cut football and add LAX and you can stop awarding 60 scholarships to women's teams. A huge cost savings and now you can pay Oats $2.5 Million a year. It gives you a lot more options if you cut football. But they aren't cutting football. I don't want them to drop football, but if they did I would rather hockey than LAX. I agree though, they aren't cutting football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikescherrer8 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 1 hour ago, dutchcountry7 said: No it wouldn't. The problem would be that UB would be kicked out of the MAC and not have a viable home. Who would take the Bulls? I don't see the A10 offering an invite. Horizon league? That's a drop in conference. America East? That has some good teams but would just put all the SUNY schools together. That does nothing to help UB standout... There is no other conference that is a good fit. The MAC is a great fit. Has some good basketball. the A-10 is full of private schools, UB ain't going there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChubbyHubby Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 15 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said: You could also add a men's team, like LAX, that is a fraction of the cost of football to get the minimum number of sports. You cut football and add LAX and you have a huge cost savings and now you can pay Oats $2.5 Million a year. It gives you a lot more options if you cut football. But they aren't cutting football. It is important to remember that not every sport give the full allotment of scholarships. They could give more scholarships to the teams that remain. Cut football, add LAX, and get the same 50-100 people in the stands that we have for soccer. This is in no way disrespectful to the soccer student-ahtletes. It's just a fact that it doesn't draw many fans, and LAX likely wouldn't either. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubmae86 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 4 hours ago, UB92 said: This game must have been very distracting!! I had to read your post several times to figure it out... It was incredibly distracting, haha. What I meant was, Saint Marys put together an amazing game and shows how to effectively dismantle a #1 seed. The biggest thing they did was only give Gonzaga 1 shot on the offensive end each time up the floor. Hunter was a machine down low and it is so important that Perkins asserts his will down low. Also, as much as our boys take shots early in the shot clock, if we find ourselves against a 1, we need to make sure to eat up some of that clock on the offense. We can't always run and gun because I feel like that would not be the best thing on every offensive possession against a UNC or Virginia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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