Jump to content
Buffalo Bulls - UB Fan Forum

How will Oats do at Bama?


How will Oats do at Alabama?  

58 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, bull_trojan said:

10,224 average this year. Average season price of $235... generating about $2.4 million for this NIT level team...if he can pack the house that would generate 3.5 million and would make Oats a very reasonable expense

They went from 13,000 to 10,000??? I wonder why with such a great SEC pedicree!!! I think they had a lot of bad weather in Alabama but I don’t want to bad mouth the Alabama weather like Oats did to Buffalo when he got off his private plane in Alabama!!!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bama fan here. I was searching for perspective from UB fans on Oats and found this board. I saw some comments up the board about Bama fans' expectations. Honestly, I think most of our folks just want to be relevant enough to be in the tournament more years than not and play a fun brand of basketball. We aren't expecting national titles or Final Fours. We wouldn't turn those things down, either, but if we make the tournament and play hard, that's the goal. 

Our last two coaches, Anthony Grant and Avery Johnson, played really slow, sloppy brands of basketball. I am envious when I watch games like Purdue/UT last night, Duke/UCF, and your Buffalo teams, who move the ball well, take care of the ball, and score efficiently. We have been the polar opposite - our team generally consists of a bunch of really great athletes playing rag-tag ball and generally not giving much effort. That's one of the main reasons we are excited about having Coach Oats. He is the opposite of everything we have come to expect in a good way. 

You guys have a hell of a program and, in the eyes of most basketball savvy fans around the country, are becoming a program in the mold of Gonzaga, VCU, Wichita, etc. where you've built it to a point that people expect you to keep doing well even if you lose coaches. 

Would love any perspective on Nate Oats. We will absolutely be pulling for you guys from now on and perhaps we can get a home and home scheduled or find a way to match up in a pre-conference tournament. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As a possible scenario for the future, take a look at current Akron coach John Groce.  Started by working his way up as an assistant over a ~15 year span, then eventually landed his first HC position at MAC school Ohio U. In terms of post-season success at Ohio, Groce has done better than Oats at Buffalo.  In his second season, the Bobcats upset Georgetown in the NCAAs as a 14-seed. In his fourth season, he took Ohio into the second weekend, ie. won two games and earned a spot in the Sweet 16.  Lost to UNC in overtime. He was that season's hot mid-major coach and got poached by Illinois. In his 5 seasons in Champaign-Urbana, he made the NCAA field just once. After Illinois fired him, he came back to the MAC with Akron.

Not saying the same will happen with Oats at UA, but it's representative of coaching trajectories in the mid-majors. When coaches build up a program to the point where it can compete with P5, they invariably leave for more money.  The departed program will suffer a setback and revert to the mean.  That's why there is so much parity in the MAC and the other mid-majors (exception being WCC and Gonzaga). It's self-limiting in the same way as pro sports, except the salary cap is implicit instead of a league rule. I hope you are right that Buffalo continues to move forward in spite of the coaching carousel, but I think it's unlikely.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, BamaAlum05 said:

Bama fan here. I was searching for perspective from UB fans on Oats and found this board. I saw some comments up the board about Bama fans' expectations. Honestly, I think most of our folks just want to be relevant enough to be in the tournament more years than not and play a fun brand of basketball. We aren't expecting national titles or Final Fours. We wouldn't turn those things down, either, but if we make the tournament and play hard, that's the goal. 

Our last two coaches, Anthony Grant and Avery Johnson, played really slow, sloppy brands of basketball. I am envious when I watch games like Purdue/UT last night, Duke/UCF, and your Buffalo teams, who move the ball well, take care of the ball, and score efficiently. We have been the polar opposite - our team generally consists of a bunch of really great athletes playing rag-tag ball and generally not giving much effort. That's one of the main reasons we are excited about having Coach Oats. He is the opposite of everything we have come to expect in a good way. 

You guys have a hell of a program and, in the eyes of most basketball savvy fans around the country, are becoming a program in the mold of Gonzaga, VCU, Wichita, etc. where you've built it to a point that people expect you to keep doing well even if you lose coaches. 

Would love any perspective on Nate Oats. We will absolutely be pulling for you guys from now on and perhaps we can get a home and home scheduled or find a way to match up in a pre-conference tournament. 

Oats everything you'll love about him you will hate when and if he is no longer your Coach. He is a take no prisoners type of guy when it comes to basketball. He will tell people like it is in pressers as well.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, everlast2504 said:

Oats everything you'll love about him you will hate when and if he is no longer your Coach. He is a take no prisoners type of guy when it comes to basketball. He will tell people like it is in pressers as well.  

He will tell you what you want to hear. He came in as a humble grass roots type guy and like all the people when they get in a position of power and influence will forget about the consequences of his words and his actions. Who in his right mind signs a contract extension with up to 1 million tells everyone he loves it here and get everyone's Hopes up and bolts the first sign of more money. You probably won’t have to worry about that because if he doe not turn your team around he will be gone in 4/5 years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, DooleyBull06 said:

 

Read the thread if you guys can...look at these numbers! And the buyouts. Insane.

One word, Wow. I always wondered why was the UB buyout so low? 750k buyout for a 4+ million dollar deal. It always seemed ridiculously low. This one is 8 million dollar buyout on a 12 million dollar deal (around 2/3), whereas our buyout was not even 20%. Did UB screw up in the buyout numbers, or were those the only numbers put in place where he would sign?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, DooleyBull06 said:

 

Read the thread if you guys can...look at these numbers! And the buyouts. Insane.

Comparing apples and oranges. When he signed his extension for $837,000 our family was going to take up a collection for him. Again the majority of fans on this site just care about the money, money,money!!!! I thought he would get his Grand Island home paid off and have a paid home in Alabama???????

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, BamaAlum05 said:

Bama fan here. I was searching for perspective from UB fans on Oats and found this board. I saw some comments up the board about Bama fans' expectations. Honestly, I think most of our folks just want to be relevant enough to be in the tournament more years than not and play a fun brand of basketball. We aren't expecting national titles or Final Fours. We wouldn't turn those things down, either, but if we make the tournament and play hard, that's the goal. 

Our last two coaches, Anthony Grant and Avery Johnson, played really slow, sloppy brands of basketball. I am envious when I watch games like Purdue/UT last night, Duke/UCF, and your Buffalo teams, who move the ball well, take care of the ball, and score efficiently. We have been the polar opposite - our team generally consists of a bunch of really great athletes playing rag-tag ball and generally not giving much effort. That's one of the main reasons we are excited about having Coach Oats. He is the opposite of everything we have come to expect in a good way. 

You guys have a hell of a program and, in the eyes of most basketball savvy fans around the country, are becoming a program in the mold of Gonzaga, VCU, Wichita, etc. where you've built it to a point that people expect you to keep doing well even if you lose coaches. 

Would love any perspective on Nate Oats. We will absolutely be pulling for you guys from now on and perhaps we can get a home and home scheduled or find a way to match up in a pre-conference tournament. 

My perspective on Oats, very good motivator.  The players like him and they play for him.  He has had the luck to land in a situation where UB has just been much more athletic and talented then his opponents so his coaching credentials have not been overly tested.  We will see now.  His record vs NCAA teams this past season, 2-2.  Not bad but we did have 5 seniors.  Last year, 1-5.  And still that one win is what he is known for.  I wish him well, but I don’t see him a game changer at the SEC.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, John said:

Comparing apples and oranges. When he signed his extension for $837,000 our family was going to take up a collection for him. Again the majority of fans on this site just care about the money, money,money!!!! I thought he would get his Grand Island home paid off and have a paid home in Alabama???????

Dude I’m not comparing anything. I’m just putting a tweet out about the contract details and letting all of you make your own assessments. I just stated that the numbers are huge. Didn’t make any further remarks or comparisons to his contract with us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, BamaAlum05 said:

Bama fan here. I was searching for perspective from UB fans on Oats and found this board. I saw some comments up the board about Bama fans' expectations. Honestly, I think most of our folks just want to be relevant enough to be in the tournament more years than not and play a fun brand of basketball. We aren't expecting national titles or Final Fours. We wouldn't turn those things down, either, but if we make the tournament and play hard, that's the goal. 

Our last two coaches, Anthony Grant and Avery Johnson, played really slow, sloppy brands of basketball. I am envious when I watch games like Purdue/UT last night, Duke/UCF, and your Buffalo teams, who move the ball well, take care of the ball, and score efficiently. We have been the polar opposite - our team generally consists of a bunch of really great athletes playing rag-tag ball and generally not giving much effort. That's one of the main reasons we are excited about having Coach Oats. He is the opposite of everything we have come to expect in a good way. 

You guys have a hell of a program and, in the eyes of most basketball savvy fans around the country, are becoming a program in the mold of Gonzaga, VCU, Wichita, etc. where you've built it to a point that people expect you to keep doing well even if you lose coaches. 

Would love any perspective on Nate Oats. We will absolutely be pulling for you guys from now on and perhaps we can get a home and home scheduled or find a way to match up in a pre-conference tournament. 

Oats is a high energy coach, very enthusiastic, doesn’t come across as exactly cerebral but wouldn’t sell him short in the smarts department. He’ll play up-tempo style and stress teamwork, unselfishness, and tough defense. How far that gets him in the SEC will depend a lot on recruiting and keeping recruits. In that regard I don’t see him challenging Kentucky, but he could lead BAMA to parity with the upper echelon of the other SEC teams. Would love to meet Alabama down the road in a tournament or home/home.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, MillenniumBull said:

My perspective on Oats, very good motivator.  The players like him and they play for him.  He has had the luck to land in a situation where UB has just been much more athletic and talented then his opponents so his coaching credentials have not been overly tested.  We will see now.  His record vs NCAA teams this past season, 2-2.  Not bad but we did have 5 seniors.  Last year, 1-5.  And still that one win is what he is known for.  I wish him well, but I don’t see him a game changer at the SEC.

There is an old expression... "The real power hides behind the throne". "Wild Oats" was the frontman screaming, yelling and "F" bombing his players on the court. Whitesell was calm and collected calming them down and strategizing. Hodgson kept up the encouragement. After Marshall left I believe UB lost the bench ability to develop the players without the 2 years of JUCO or post grad prep experience. I'll give him 2-3x as long as "Spoon" lasted at Alabama meaning in 3 years he'll be back at a low mid-major. Oats is not Bruce Pearl or Brad Stevens. I sadly witnessed Todd Licklitter leave my son's squad at Butler after tournament success including a sweet 16 taking a few assistants with him to Iowa (including the current Butler HC LaVall Jordan and current AHC Jeff Meyer. The "Butler Way" didn't work there and they were out in 3 years whereas Butler continued their winning ways after the promotion of an assistant coach including consecutive Final Fours and transformation from the Horizon league to the A-10 and now to the Big East.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/28/2019 at 9:53 AM, SGBull said:

A lot of negativity about him over at the Alabama forum. 

To be fair, no matter who we hire there will likely be a lot of negatively here too lol.  The hardcore fanbase is rarely happy with a hire.  I recall UB fans in general being quite upset with UB promoting Oats without looking for another splash hired like Hurley...I wouldn't really trust a fan's opinion as worth much of anything haha.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, squire17 said:

Oats is a high energy coach, very enthusiastic, doesn’t come across as exactly cerebral but wouldn’t sell him short in the smarts department. He’ll play up-tempo style and stress teamwork, unselfishness, and tough defense. How far that gets him in the SEC will depend a lot on recruiting and keeping recruits. In that regard I don’t see him challenging Kentucky, but he could lead BAMA to parity with the upper echelon of the other SEC teams. Would love to meet Alabama down the road in a tournament or home/home.

Thanks to everyone for the objective responses. Much appreciated. 

My concern is his ability to recruit at an SEC level. I actually think he might have some initial success because if he can get our returning soph PG stay in the program, the roster isn’t exactly bare. It was just poorly coached and completely unmotivated. 

The challenge will be turning the roster over in 2-3 years with guys who can compete at a high level. We will see.

Coaching searches are funny. Half the fan base automatically talks themselves into the hire being the greatest thing ever because no new coach has ever lost a press conference. The other half second guesses every move because they feel like they could do better. 

It will be interesting to see if a guy from Wisconsin who has coached in Western NY for several years can relate to a southern fan base. It’s definitely not a logical cultural fit. But there are rumors our top recruiter from the old staff (who is a Bama grad) may be retained for continuity. 

Edited by BamaAlum05
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no reason to believe that Nate will do anything other than be successful at Alabama, which is a reason why his departure is so hurtful. He was a successful HS coach, successful assistant coach and very successful as our coach, leading us to places that we only could dream of. He's intelligent and a go-getter, who plays the style of game that would attract young players, and at a "big place" like that, he'll get his choice. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

48 minutes ago, BamaAlum05 said:

Thanks to everyone for the objective responses. Much appreciated. 

My concern is his ability to recruit at an SEC level. I actually think he might have some initial success because if he can get our returning soph PG stay in the program, the roster isn’t exactly bare. It was just poorly coached and completely unmotivated. 

The challenge will be turning the roster over in 2-3 years with guys who can compete at a high level. We will see.

Coaching searches are funny. Half the fan base automatically talks themselves into the hire being the greatest thing ever because no new coach has ever lost a press conference. The other half second guesses every move because they feel like they could do better. 

It will be interesting to see if a guy from Wisconsin who has coached in Western NY for several years can relate to a southern fan base. It’s definitely not a logical cultural fit. But there are rumors our top recruiter from the old staff (who is a Bama grad) may be retained for continuity. 

Here's the deal with Oats (from my perspective).

1.  Instilled confidence in the players to shoot...and shoot again.  They genuinely liked to play for him it seemed.
2.  Played a style the players liked.  Uptempo means a lot of scoring and players can get their stats...even if they don't start.
3.  Got the players to value the basketball.  Yeah...that was challenged at times, but the teams didn't turnover the ball as much as you'd expect.
4.  Seemed to get a lot out of the players.  I mean, that he put them in the best place to be successful and maximized what they do best.  At least it seemed that way from my vantage point.

5.  While this is not the 100% view of UB fans, I do believe he was of two minds:  (1)  I can make the Gonzaga of the East and (2) It would be great to make the P5 payday and all that comes with it.  Those are not compatible, obviously.   I believe he parlayed this past season's gaudy record, ranking and many PR opps to get to P5 while skipping a step.  I think he felt there may be some low-level P5 offers (or AAC, A10, etc. offers), but he wanted a reasonable P5 offer is my guess.  And, w/o that, he would have stayed at UB and continue to build the program.  Part of me thinks he was a bit surprised (just a bit) that he had so much interest in him...especially when a reasonable P5 came calling.  And...so ended the "Gonzaga of the East" dream.

6.  The new fanbase doesn't really know how college basketball works, in general, so cite "he signed a new contract" and "he betrayed us" as reasons to be mad at Oats.  But this is a business.  Of course, how he handled it over the past few days has been awful, in my opinion.  He really needed to be contrite with Buffalo (and all that comes with it) once he made his decision.  I think he was eager to show his gratitude and, thus, went "all in" with Alabama immediately.  Alabama...they don't care if he shunned Buffalo...they care about keeping recruits.  So Oats either didn't get the best advice or didn't take good advice.  

7.  I think Alabama fans will like Oats.  He's a straight shooter., though a little naive about some things (e.g. calling out coach Cal last year).  

As a Buffalo fan, Oats is now in my rearview mirror.  I'll keep an eye on him (my brother went to Alabama), so I am interested to see how Alabama plays.  But if they do poorly, I'll just shrug.   Ask Vandy about life in the SEC playing basketball.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, BamaAlum05 said:

Thanks to everyone for the objective responses. Much appreciated. 

My concern is his ability to recruit at an SEC level. I actually think he might have some initial success because if he can get our returning soph PG stay in the program, the roster isn’t exactly bare. It was just poorly coached and completely unmotivated. 

The challenge will be turning the roster over in 2-3 years with guys who can compete at a high level. We will see.

Coaching searches are funny. Half the fan base automatically talks themselves into the hire being the greatest thing ever because no new coach has ever lost a press conference. The other half second guesses every move because they feel like they could do better. 

It will be interesting to see if a guy from Wisconsin who has coached in Western NY for several years can relate to a southern fan base. It’s definitely not a logical cultural fit. But there are rumors our top recruiter from the old staff (who is a Bama grad) may be retained for continuity. 

Al the attributes from others about his coaching in a good analysis. But as a person many of us have lost all respect for him because of his words and actions during this affair. I am sure he can talk to Saban and learn how to be sarcastic and belittle anyone who tries to ask a question. But then again why  would you want to hire anyone with honesty and integrity but as so many have tried to explain this is just a business so let’s not get personal and emotional. I am sure the Alabama sports scene is alive and well and in 4/5 years you can start over again with the same rhetoric.our family have no agenda and we not follow or promote behavior from people who think they are god’s gift to mankind!!!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, ButlerAlumDad said:

There is an old expression... "The real power hides behind the throne". "Wild Oats" was the frontman screaming, yelling and "F" bombing his players on the court. Whitesell was calm and collected calming them down and strategizing. Hodgson kept up the encouragement. After Marshall left I believe UB lost the bench ability to develop the players without the 2 years of JUCO or post grad prep experience. I'll give him 2-3x as long as "Spoon" lasted at Alabama meaning in 3 years he'll be back at a low mid-major. Oats is not Bruce Pearl or Brad Stevens. I sadly witnessed Todd Licklitter leave my son's squad at Butler after tournament success including a sweet 16 taking a few assistants with him to Iowa (including the current Butler HC LaVall Jordan and current AHC Jeff Meyer. The "Butler Way" didn't work there and they were out in 3 years whereas Butler continued their winning ways after the promotion of an assistant coach including consecutive Final Fours and transformation from the Horizon league to the A-10 and now to the Big East.

How do you feel about Butler’s fit in the BE?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not so much this year. Geographically it fits. Butler can recruit against all schools though they are selective in fitting a system and shy away from 1 and done. There is also an unwritten policy, "no visit, no offer". The don't over recruit... "Creaning". They are last in the Big East in recruiting budget and still don't have a practice facility. UB according to coach JW & coach? BH were really counting on Hastings signing to be a Bull not a Bulldog. What I found different until Cleveland was the Butler team is a family. For the 1st time I saw  "Family Team Unity" among the parents at UB though it was on the women's side. At Butler we as parents traveled together, socialized, and 15 years later still are in touch. Teammates still are going to weddings, etc. and Brad Stevens is now organizing the get togethers for the team members that played for him. He took over after Joel Cornette's untimely passing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/28/2019 at 2:35 PM, zigo230 said:

Well, seeing our highly touted recruits high-tailing it outta here, I could give a crap about Oats.  Hope his club gets their butt kicked next season.  Go Kentucky, Florida, LSU,,,whoever!  

We lost 2 so far. One of which we might not of had anyway. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

On 3/30/2019 at 2:06 PM, BamaAlum05 said:

Thanks to everyone for the objective responses. Much appreciated. 

My concern is his ability to recruit at an SEC level. I actually think he might have some initial success because if he can get our returning soph PG stay in the program, the roster isn’t exactly bare. It was just poorly coached and completely unmotivated. 

The challenge will be turning the roster over in 2-3 years with guys who can compete at a high level. We will see.

Coaching searches are funny. Half the fan base automatically talks themselves into the hire being the greatest thing ever because no new coach has ever lost a press conference. The other half second guesses every move because they feel like they could do better. 

It will be interesting to see if a guy from Wisconsin who has coached in Western NY for several years can relate to a southern fan base. It’s definitely not a logical cultural fit. But there are rumors our top recruiter from the old staff (who is a Bama grad) may be retained for continuity. 

As someone who knows him pretty well and watched him as closely as anyone my strong belief is that Alabama hit it out of the ball park. He’s a damn good recruiter, he’s intelligent, a family man, plays an up tempo style, works his rear end off, recruits good citizens who play unselfish basketball. I have no idea why he hasn’t issued a statement. I am more perplexed by the silence of our AD. He hasn’t said s thing knowing the fan base is pissed. 

Calling Mark Alnut! Are you out there anywhere??? 

Edited by UB85
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/29/2019 at 7:42 PM, John said:

He will tell you what you want to hear. He came in as a humble grass roots type guy and like all the people when they get in a position of power and influence will forget about the consequences of his words and his actions. Who in his right mind signs a contract extension with up to 1 million tells everyone he loves it here and get everyone's Hopes up and bolts the first sign of more money. You probably won’t have to worry about that because if he doe not turn your team around he will be gone in 4/5 years.

John he said he loves it here and has no intention of going anywhere unless he got blown away by something. So I think you’re being harsh. Plus Nate also talked about commitment from the university regarding basketball. I can tell you first hand it was a royal pain in rear for players  who wanted to put in extra time in by getting up extra shots and could not because students and other teams were using Alumni. It you want to be successful and run a top notch program you need to have 24/7 access to the gym. My bet is that there was a lack of commitment or a hands up in the air approach to getting some of those things done that Nate often times referred to. One thing that rests its ugly head around here is a fatalism if well we can’t do that. When you have small time thinkers you get small time results. That’s why the culture changed drastically under Danny White. He had a vision of excellence and pursued it with a dogged determination. Results not seen around here previously were achieved with that attitude. I can tell yuh at this point my faith in ADMA is hovering around zero. It seems he botched this a process already. I’ll withhold definitive judgment till it plays out. But if my hunch is correct I’ll be pulling all my support for athletics.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/30/2019 at 11:13 AM, UBigbobby said:

To be fair, no matter who we hire there will likely be a lot of negatively here too lol.  The hardcore fanbase is rarely happy with a hire.  I recall UB fans in general being quite upset with UB promoting Oats without looking for another splash hired like Hurley...I wouldn't really trust a fan's opinion as worth much of anything haha.

Not me. I knew it was a slam dunk even before he was hired. I told DW as much before he announced the hire. The team at the time to a man wanted Oats. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/29/2019 at 7:58 PM, John said:

Comparing apples and oranges. When he signed his extension for $837,000 our family was going to take up a collection for him. Again the majority of fans on this site just care about the money, money,money!!!! I thought he would get his Grand Island home paid off and have a paid home in Alabama???????

We were prepared to donate a hefty sum. I knew before hand that there was a movement afoot to raise donations to help fund the contract. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...