What Can We Do? (A [Hopefully] Galvanizing Thread)

[JoeyRattlesnake]

Alright, so bear with me, I've had a couple...

I'm sitting here in Winston-Salem, NC on a work trip thinking.  I'm feverishly refreshing my twitter feed trying to find out who the next UB Men's Basketball coach will be, all the while hearing murmurs that FLJ might be off to Penn State... and it got me thinking.

What can we, as UB fans, UB Alums, do to stop this trend?  The answer is probably not much, but I'd love to explore.

I'm a 32 year old 2008 Jacobs Management alum that has an undying passion for college sports.  I grew up in a Florida Gator family.  My uncle went to school with Steve Spurrier and all I knew growing up was the Fun N' Gun.  From a young age I loved college sports.  Now, we all know that NCAA sports has changed dramatically over the past 25 years.  Not too awfully similar to NASCAR, it's be come an industry once known for it's off-the-grid passion and under the radar entertainment value to a big business.  We all know the stories of the $1B the NCAA makes off of March Madness and the transfers and the coaches jumping ship to the next biggest paycheck, but I digress.

As UB fans and Alums, what can we, as average middle-class citizens do to raise the profile, and ultimately the brand, of UB?  I wanted to believe that we caught a unicorn in Nate Oats and his staff.  And while I admittedly have taken his departure all to personal, I wonder what can someone like me with, at most, $20,000 a year in donations do to help?  Probably nothing is the unfortunate answer.   I'll likely never have a facility named after me (see the Murchie family), but I thought about asking Mark Alnutt for a meeting.  I thought about spending my own money to fly up and talk with the man to see what is it an Average Joe who played baseball for two years and has a burning passion to see my Alma-Mater succeed could do.  The truth is, he's been at UB for less than a year and has aspirations for a Power 5 job, possibly at his Alma-Mater, Missouri, if my memory serves me right.  He does not "get" UB.  He wasn't here when Turner Gill walked away for Kansas or when Leon !*$Q&$*) Williams tipped in that buzzer beater in Cleveland or when Jeff Quinn didn't pan out or when we had to say goodbye to a fan favorite in Reggie Witherspoon or when we dropped baseball.  We've seen AD after AD leave for the likes of UConn, UCF and Auburn.  I'm proud of that, in a sense.  UB's DNA is scattered throughout the landscape of college sports.  UCF is a "National Champion", Auburn is Final Four bound and Warde is now overseeing a behemoth at Michigan.  But, what about UB?  Is it donor funds?  If we rallied UB alum across the county, could we wake a sleeping giant?   We have a current student body of over 30,000.  That compares to some of the big boys.  Is it conference affiliation, which you and I have no control over?

Unfortunately, I do not have answers and unfortunately I don't think this thread will come up with many.  I want to keep this free of SUNY bashing and MAC discrediting and especially the ridicule of individuals like Nate Oats, Bryan Hodgson, Mark Alnutt and President Tripathi.  Do we as UB loving fans and alum need to be more vocal?  Not just in the good times, but always?  I'll admit, I became a Blue & White Fund donor to the Men's Basketball Excellence Fund only after last year and a cry support via this board (Thanks @Jeseph), but it's been the best thing I've done in terms of donating.  I feel more connected and more invested (both literally and figuratively). I now live in Knoxville, TN and am surrounding by a rabid, all-be-it delusional, University of Tennessee fan base.  These people love their teams and university like none I've ever seen.  I'm sure drawing numbers for Saturdays in the fall is easy when you're hosting top 25 teams on the regular and you know you're one year away from being the top story on SportsCenter makes is easier.  Is it that?  Is it passion? Or is it the opportunity, even if your team sucks, (and believe me UT football has sucked) to make a splash on the national landscape when hosting Alabama, Florida or Georgia any given week?

Thank you Danny White, Bobby Hurley, Allan Greene and Nate Oats.  Thanks for making us relevant.  Thank you for having my colleagues giving me unsolicited complainants this season, saying things like "Man, UB is really good!" or "I've got Buffalo in my Sweet 16!". I'm willing to hear everyone out here.  I want to help and raise UB to the platform we all know we deserve.  To be on the tongue of all fans, recruits and sportscasters nation wide.

GO BULLS!

[bull_trojan]

2007 Jacobs here what up!

1) We lived through the worst, and even our most uninspired times (i.e. quinn) we haven't gone backwards. So that keeps me happy, we've stumbled, but we've moved forward, faster than I thought possible.

2) Win. In the era before us, there was nothing to capture hearts and minds. We had the '05 Basketball team and the '08 Football team. This year will capture a lot more, eventually it will be enough.

3) Personally, I think every fan and donor should be pushing for a plan...if we had a plan, I don't think we'd feel so lost...even if the plan said we'd get our arena renovated in 2030 we'd at least know we're working towards a goal...if our goals were Fieldhouse -> retain coaches ->???, we're now: done -> failed - > ????, and that's a very rough place to be.

[BrooklynBull]

If you want to know about what you can do I would suggest not starting at the top but with the Development Office.  Depending on what your thoughts are for what you want to do there would be different people to contact.  Work your way around this site http://bullsbwf.com/ and then contact the person who is in charge of what you would like to do.

I do not know how you split up your $20,000.00 a year donation budget, but with a multiyear gift you could possibly name something after your self.  The more you are willing to give the bigger the place where your name could go.

I think that part of your frustration is over UB not being a final destination job for coaches and administrators.  The question is if there really is a  true final destination for a coach or administrator anymore.  This is an issue even for the big boys.  Saban walked away from the  Michigan State for LSU (in a rather ugly situation, repeated when he went to the Dolphins and then Alabama).  Williams walked away from Kansas for North Carolina (admittedly his alma mata).

If you want a coach to stay for the long term at UB you need a coach like Frank Solich.  He was fired because winning 9-10 games a year was not enough at Nebraska.  He ends up at Ohio and is pretty much going to a bowl game every year with occasional trips to MAC Championship game.  Everyone there is happy with that and he has no desire to go back to the BS that is involved with the big programs.  The problem is that it is hard to find 60 year old coaches in that situation.

The good news is that if the big programs are hiring away coaches from UB it means that UB is making the right hires and winning.  In a world of haves and have nots it will be almost impossible for UB to match the salaries that the big schools can pay.  So sit back and enjoy what is happening now an it will hopefully continue.

[UB05]

Great post. Donations are great and I’m sure the success of the past couple seasons have helped fans like yourself step forward to contribute. I think the biggest hurdle the program has to get over is becoming a brand and a logo that the community and alumni become invested in. We have the population and the alumni to become a major sports school but the history and tradition is not there yet to keep people engaged. The more people jump on the bandwagon the quicker the train moves. I don’t know how to keep the momentum going other than keep winning and as individual fans keep talking proud about the program trying to get others interested.

[rma]

5 hours ago, BrooklynBull said:

If you want a coach to stay for the long term at UB you need a coach like Frank Solich

That was supposed to be Felisha Legette Jack (though admittedly much younger). Failed at a big job, now close to family, winning games, a year away from the all time wins record....and she’s gone. 

[Jeseph]

57 minutes ago, rma said:

...and she’s gone. 

While likely, she was offered the job. AFAIK she has yet to accept.

[UB92]

6 hours ago, BrooklynBull said:

If you want to know about what you can do I would suggest not starting at the top but with the Development Office.  Depending on what your thoughts are for what you want to do there would be different people to contact.  Work your way around this site http://bullsbwf.com/ and then contact the person who is in charge of what you would like to do.

I do not know how you split up your $20,000.00 a year donation budget, but with a multiyear gift you could possibly name something after your self.  The more you are willing to give the bigger the place where your name could go.

I think that part of your frustration is over UB not being a final destination job for coaches and administrators.  The question is if there really is a  true final destination for a coach or administrator anymore.  This is an issue even for the big boys.  Saban walked away from the  Michigan State for LSU (in a rather ugly situation, repeated when he went to the Dolphins and then Alabama).  Williams walked away from Kansas for North Carolina (admittedly his alma mata).

If you want a coach to stay for the long term at UB you need a coach like Frank Solich.  He was fired because winning 9-10 games a year was not enough at Nebraska.  He ends up at Ohio and is pretty much going to a bowl game every year with occasional trips to MAC Championship game.  Everyone there is happy with that and he has no desire to go back to the BS that is involved with the big programs.  The problem is that it is hard to find 60 year old coaches in that situation.

The good news is that if the big programs are hiring away coaches from UB it means that UB is making the right hires and winning.  In a world of haves and have nots it will be almost impossible for UB to match the salaries that the big schools can pay.  So sit back and enjoy what is happening now an it will hopefully continue.

This was a good, reasoned post. 

I made boldface two points.  I discuss them below.

1.  If we think coaches are going to come here and stay for 10 years or more and make us the "Gonzaga of the East" (or whatever BS is handed out), it is naive.  UB is a step.  We have to realize that.  But it is a step towards the top...like 2/3rds up the stair.  I haven't looked, but I would expect coach turnover in the back half (especially bball) is probably very high.   The coaches come and go, but what stays is us -- the fans.  We stay as coaches (and players) move in and out.   We are the constants and, hopefully, adding more to our ranks each year.  That has to be the strategy -- focus on who we are -- Buffalo.  Bleed Blue.  People are losing their mind because successful coaches are leaving.  If they don't want to be here, we need to make it a place where there will be plenty more interested.   UB moving to the AAC may address some issues, but it certainly won't address coaches leaving.

2.  Duh.  Winning.  You are right...enjoy the winning.  But we need to keep it up.  Winning cures a lot of problems.  If the next MBB coach goes 13 - 5 in conference and UB is a #2 seed with a bye, it will be "Nate who?"  Winning makes people forget.  We have to keep winning and other, good things follow.

 

I have more thoughts on this issue that Joey has brought up, but I want to think more about it.

Go Bulls!

 

 

 

 

[ed]

16 hours ago, JoeyRattlesnake said:

But, what about UB?  Is it donor funds?  If we rallied UB alum across the county, could we wake a sleeping giant?   We have a current student body of over 30,000.  That compares to some of the big boys.  Is it conference affiliation, which you and I have no control over?

Unfortunately, I do not have answers and unfortunately I don't think this thread will come up with many.  I want to keep this free of SUNY bashing and MAC discrediting and especially the ridicule of individuals like Nate Oats, Bryan Hodgson, Mark Alnutt and President Tripathi.  Do we as UB loving fans and alum need to be more vocal?  Not just in the good times, but always?  I'll admit, I became a Blue & White Fund donor to the Men's Basketball Excellence Fund only after last year and a cry support via this board (Thanks @Jeseph), but it's been the best thing I've done in terms of donating. 

i don't donate. thought about it, but i don't know what i'm donating to.  there's no plan (at least not one widely available).  looked into the excellence fund - a slush fund for a ncaa coach?  the jokes practically writes itself.  plus the hassle of booster rules? uh, no thanks.   blue and white fund?  i don't even know what it is - bullsblueandwhite.com doesn't resolve, and bullsbwf.com is blacklisted at work (our blacklist/whitelist is customizable, but commercially based).  somebody should look into that.  but seriously, a plan.  a workable plan, not a pipedream.  

edit: oh yea, and nobody ever got back to me about tickets for the ncaa tournament. the ub basketball ticket site had info about the mac tournament up after selection sunday - you had to go back up a level to find any info about the tournament. ub doesn't really make it easy to be a fan.

Edited April 2, 2019 by ed

[Jeseph]

17 minutes ago, ed said:

i don't donate. thought about it, but i don't know what i'm donating to.  there's no plan (at least not one widely available).  looked into the excellence fund - a slush fund for a ncaa coach?  the jokes practically writes itself.  plus the hassle of booster rules? uh, no thanks.   blue and white fund?  i don't even know what it is - bullsblueandwhite.com doesn't resolve, and bullsbwf.com is blacklisted at work (our blacklist/whitelist is customizable, but commercially based).  somebody should look into that.  but seriously, a plan.  a workable plan, not a pipedream.  

edit: oh yea, and nobody ever got back to me about tickets for the ncaa tournament. the ub basketball ticket site had info about the mac tournament up after selection sunday - you had to go back up a level to find any info about the tournament. ub doesn't really make it easy to be a fan.

Unfortunately I agree with your point made in bold here...

I know it's not your job to do so but have you contacted these departments in the offseason (specifically the ticket office) to share your concerns? Sometimes I think these people slip into an echo chamber and don't realize these things (or the extent to which they frustrate fans).

I bought 2 shirts from ubbulls.com that were really disappointing in quality, I'll be sharing that info with them so they can hopefully make changes in the future.

[McBulls]

I don't have the answer, but I overheard ButlerAlumDad's vision and it goes a little something like this:

1. Reinstate the UB Athletic Advisory Council with BAD as president.

2. Hire present graduate assistant at Butler as UB's new head coach. Assistants will be selected from Monsignor Martin Athletic Association staff because...

3. We will recruit only MMAC players without other scholarship offers to fill our roster.

4. Do away with Blue Collar gimmick of Coach Oats. Replace by branding ourselves "The Butler of the East." Our formal motto will be: "SUNY Buffalo- New York State's Butler. Serving families of NYC and LI since 1863." Commentators will simply refer to us as "Butler's Butler."

5. At coach's introductory press conference, all questions regarding how to recruit to Buffalo, compete in the MAC, and put on a pair of pants will be answered glibly with: "The Butler Way."

6. Marshawn Lynch will mistake the condescending pretense of "The Butler Way" responses for a principled stand against forced media sessions. He will replace Jim Kelly and Thurman Thomas as our most vocal ex-Bill backer and...

7. Be named to the board of the UB Foundation, where he will...

8. Spearhead the sale of Alumni Arena (a poor venue, after all), and...

9. Invest the proceeds along with our endowment to purchase common stock in Dave and Buster's Entertainment Inc. (NASDAQ: PLAY, market cap 1.95B), threatening to attempt a hostile takeover unless...

10. The company is renamed Dave and Butler's.

11. Butler's Butler receives a generous donation from Dave and Butler's to build a new arena (The Butler), prompting...

12. Generous donors to come out of the woodwork.

13. Buffalo wins the 2022 National Championship.

14. Kevin writes an article the night of the title win lamenting the poor efficiency rating in the title game win and ponders the potential for a low KenPom rating to begin the 2023 season.

15. Dave and Butler's stock soars, The Butler of the East sells, and using the earnings and publicity from the National Championship win to garner entrance to the Big Ten.

16. Nate Oats and Bryan Hodgson are last seen hosting a 3 a.m. public access program on Alabama basketball. The only caller is an intoxicated Bruce Pearl who hurls insults at the unsuspecting coaches. The show ends as follows:

Oats: Thanks for tuning in! And just remember...

Hodgson: From Mobile to Tuscaloosa...

Together: Alabama is BASKETBALL COUNTRY!

[rma]

2 hours ago, Jeseph said:

I bought 2 shirts from ubbulls.com that were really disappointing in quality, I'll be sharing that info with them so they can hopefully make changes in the future.

I've said this probably a million times before, the quality of apparel at UB is maybe a step above literal dog shit, but not much more.  $10 tee shirts are great, but they fit like garbage.  There's not much between that and $45 dry fit shirts.  The basketball jerseys are decent quality, but I wish we had them in white (or better, blue).  The fan football jerseys are garbage, possibly worse than the DHGate Khalil Mack jerseys with the HUGE New York logo on it.  The blue collar shirts were nice but we're done with that I suppose.  I think everything that's on the online store is garbage screen printed/embroidered UB logo on generic branded apparel.  I still wear some of the free giveaway shirts from when I was a student because a few of them were printed on Gildan shirts (I'm sure whoever screwed up and splurged on these premium shirts was quickly terminated).

Beating a dead horse again, I'm likely going to the WVU spring game and their annual gear sale this year.  In the past authentic football jerseys were sold for around $80, ~$20 more than a UB jersey.  Maybe I can find a #50 WVU jersey from where Graves posterized Konate.  Those are $20.

[squire17]

McBulls, I admire your plan. However, you have forgotten a crucial element: The fight song. May I suggest, “That’s the Butler Way”? As you may have surmised the lyrics would revolve around the Butler Way...the music would be a straight steal from Budwey’s, the closed supermarket. 

Player after player;

Year after year.

That’s the Butler,

That’s the Butler,

That’s the Butler Way!

 

[UB85]

19 hours ago, JoeyRattlesnake said:

Alright, so bear with me, I've had a couple...

I'm sitting here in Winston-Salem, NC on a work trip thinking.  I'm feverishly refreshing my twitter feed trying to find out who the next UB Men's Basketball coach will be, all the while hearing murmurs that FLJ might be off to Penn State... and it got me thinking.

What can we, as UB fans, UB Alums, do to stop this trend?  The answer is probably not much, but I'd love to explore.

I'm a 32 year old 2008 Jacobs Management alum that has an undying passion for college sports.  I grew up in a Florida Gator family.  My uncle went to school with Steve Spurrier and all I knew growing up was the Fun N' Gun.  From a young age I loved college sports.  Now, we all know that NCAA sports has changed dramatically over the past 25 years.  Not too awfully similar to NASCAR, it's be come an industry once known for it's off-the-grid passion and under the radar entertainment value to a big business.  We all know the stories of the $1B the NCAA makes off of March Madness and the transfers and the coaches jumping ship to the next biggest paycheck, but I digress.

As UB fans and Alums, what can we, as average middle-class citizens do to raise the profile, and ultimately the brand, of UB?  I wanted to believe that we caught a unicorn in Nate Oats and his staff.  And while I admittedly have taken his departure all to personal, I wonder what can someone like me with, at most, $20,000 a year in donations do to help?  Probably nothing is the unfortunate answer.   I'll likely never have a facility named after me (see the Murchie family), but I thought about asking Mark Alnutt for a meeting.  I thought about spending my own money to fly up and talk with the man to see what is it an Average Joe who played baseball for two years and has a burning passion to see my Alma-Mater succeed could do.  The truth is, he's been at UB for less than a year and has aspirations for a Power 5 job, possibly at his Alma-Mater, Missouri, if my memory serves me right.  He does not "get" UB.  He wasn't here when Turner Gill walked away for Kansas or when Leon !*$Q&$*) Williams tipped in that buzzer beater in Cleveland or when Jeff Quinn didn't pan out or when we had to say goodbye to a fan favorite in Reggie Witherspoon or when we dropped baseball.  We've seen AD after AD leave for the likes of UConn, UCF and Auburn.  I'm proud of that, in a sense.  UB's DNA is scattered throughout the landscape of college sports.  UCF is a "National Champion", Auburn is Final Four bound and Warde is now overseeing a behemoth at Michigan.  But, what about UB?  Is it donor funds?  If we rallied UB alum across the county, could we wake a sleeping giant?   We have a current student body of over 30,000.  That compares to some of the big boys.  Is it conference affiliation, which you and I have no control over?

Unfortunately, I do not have answers and unfortunately I don't think this thread will come up with many.  I want to keep this free of SUNY bashing and MAC discrediting and especially the ridicule of individuals like Nate Oats, Bryan Hodgson, Mark Alnutt and President Tripathi.  Do we as UB loving fans and alum need to be more vocal?  Not just in the good times, but always?  I'll admit, I became a Blue & White Fund donor to the Men's Basketball Excellence Fund only after last year and a cry support via this board (Thanks @Jeseph), but it's been the best thing I've done in terms of donating.  I feel more connected and more invested (both literally and figuratively). I now live in Knoxville, TN and am surrounding by a rabid, all-be-it delusional, University of Tennessee fan base.  These people love their teams and university like none I've ever seen.  I'm sure drawing numbers for Saturdays in the fall is easy when you're hosting top 25 teams on the regular and you know you're one year away from being the top story on SportsCenter makes is easier.  Is it that?  Is it passion? Or is it the opportunity, even if your team sucks, (and believe me UT football has sucked) to make a splash on the national landscape when hosting Alabama, Florida or Georgia any given week?

Thank you Danny White, Bobby Hurley, Allan Greene and Nate Oats.  Thanks for making us relevant.  Thank you for having my colleagues giving me unsolicited complainants this season, saying things like "Man, UB is really good!" or "I've got Buffalo in my Sweet 16!". I'm willing to hear everyone out here.  I want to help and raise UB to the platform we all know we deserve.  To be on the tongue of all fans, recruits and sportscasters nation wide.

GO BULLS!

Wonderful thoughts and post! In my view it all starts with leadership/vision. It’s no coincidence that athletic success, while scattered in the years before, became a regular occurrence after Danny White was hired. His vision was big time athletics at UB as the next great athletics brand. He raised the expectations within the athletic department. He demanded more. FLJ was concerned she was going to get fired if her team did not start winning. The morale of the department was elevated with White’s leadership. We saw MAC championships in men’s and women’s basketball, women’s soccer and tennis. Take it however you will, but one reason Oats left is he did not think UB shared his vision and priorities. So for me anyway it all comes down to what UB envisions itself as and where it wants to be. Some said you could not win at UB, you could not recruit to UB and nothing was destined to change. Fortunately White, Hurley, Nate, FLJ proved all those naysayers wrong. I talked to various people and some of UB’s biggest donors as the season was coming to a close with the same question of how are we going to keep Nate. Sadly the response was from a few I don’t know that we can. My reply someone needs to sit down with him and ask him directly what will it take to keep you here long term. I would then have drawn up the plan to do so. I don’t know Alnut but have briefly talked to him a few times. I ran into one of his top assistants before the end of the regular season. I was told that there was an effort underway to get a new contract done funded by the university and with donations of 25k, 50k and 100k of boosters to raise Nate's salary and those of his assistants. I said I’d be willing to help solicit donors as I knew many that would likely want to help. The suggestion was made that we sit down for lunch sometime soon, which never materialized. I talked to my wife about this and we were prepared to donate 25k to help retain Nate. I am happy to support a mission of excellence. But have zero interest in supporting mediocrity or stumbling along without a vision of excellence. I think most of us having experienced what is possible at UB would like to see it continue. The question for all I believe is whether the university wants to do what is necessary to make it happen. If there isn’t a total buy in then it’s likely we’ve seen the golden age of UB basketball over the last several years. 

[JoeyRattlesnake]

On 4/2/2019 at 1:46 AM, BrooklynBull said:

Williams walked away from Kansas for North Carolina (admittedly his alma mata).

Not to be a jerk, but Alma mater is a perfectly acceptable use of the term and considered grammatically correct. - https://www.google.com/search?newwindow=1&rlz=1C1OKWM_enUS763US764&ei=S8KkXJibKsSIggeWg4HoCg&q=alma+mater&oq=alma+mater&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39j0l6j0i20i263j0l2.9865.10177..10449...0.0..0.123.285.2j1......0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71.sE4QRbhXcyM

Also, while I get the sentiment, I do not want Frank Solich.  That's effectively what we had in Reggie.  Solid year in and year out, but really not much of a chance to do anything great.  I agree, if coaches and ADs are getting hired, you've done something right.  Just not sure how schools elevate their status.  Gonzaga is the obvious example, but even Wichita State, VCU and Butler did it.  They still lose coaches from time to time, but somehow maintain their level of success and have larger budgets than UB for coaching.  I'm not sure if the A10 is a better conference financially or not.