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Should MAC restructure?


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I for the most part like being a member of the MAC and I don’t see any better conference calling UB’s number ever, or at least anytime soon.

my problem with the conference is we have no rivalry. And there is a built in cross division rivalry game with Toledo and Bowling Green. Why not move BGSU out west, and send EMU east. Because the annual BGSU vs TU game, football scheduling is not balanced.  And if we are to develope a rival in this league EMU may be our best shot. CMU and WMU want nothing to do with them anyway and it wouldn’t hurt travel for any team that much. Build a trophy, assault their manhood’s and their moms, get it done! Akron will always have Kent, Miami will always have Ohio, call the MAC and get us a dancing partner.

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16 hours ago, MillenniumBull said:

Except UB is maybe 5th on the AACs radar.  If the conference had to dig that deep what exactly would be left there?

What do you base that on? Mark Alnutt has the Memphis AAC connection. I would hope UCF's Danny White would endorse us to join as well. (He can take the credit for starting our rise.)  I think Buffalo is an ideal addition to the AAC. Top 60 TV market, New York State presence for the conference, long history with Temple.

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AAC TV deal expires July 1, 2020, ESPN  has a 30 day negotiation window that ends around the end of February '19.

American can take ESPN's deal, or shop around, but they cannot take a deal for less than what ESPN offers.

I'm reading people like Danny White saying the current AAC deal under-values the conference. They currently get about 1.7 million/year, double the MAC's payout, but still less than a third of the (new) Big East's payout. AAC has said they want a P6 payout.

The P5 is getting:

B1G 440 million/season: 220 from Fox, 190 from ESPN 10 from CBS (basketball) - 31.4 million/school
SEC 380 million/season: 255 from ESPN/CBS and 125 from SEC Network - 27.14 million/school
ACC 238 million/season from ESPN. = 17 million/school. Hoping for additional 140 million once ACC net launches would give - 27 million/ school
PAC  225 million/season - 18.75 million/school
Big  200 million/season from ESPN/Fox - 20 million/school

Also the MWC deal is up at the same time, so the two top mid-major conferences will be negotiating against each other. If you were ESPN, what would you do?

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Long history with Temple? I’m have to assume that statement is about the university taking Jewish holidays off because otherwise it makes no sense to me. We had some great games, in only one sport for a few years. There are a bunch of schools with long histories with the current membership of the AAC and UB is not one of them. And ADs don’t make conference choices, the presidents do.

If AAC loses schools and needs to add, it would be most likely losing one or two of their northern schools (UC or UCONN) and filling with southern old rivals. And if they did want to go with a NE school they would give Army a sweetheart deal before even talking to UB. And why would UB want to join a conference that wide spread and where no alumni live?  that extra tv money goes away really fast when the tennis team (and all the rest, not hating on the tennis team, their actually pretty great) needs a plane  every week.

 

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I don't think conferences are going to beat the doors down to get UB an invite.  But I do believe if the University is looking to move up, make athletics a larger priority, more revenue, higher profile, keep coaches, etc..  that the time is now.  The new indoor field house is a game changer too.   If they lose these coaches and the play on the field/court levels off in a couple years, UB won't look all that attractive anymore.  

It's a tough call because I feel that the U at B should similar in athletics stature to programs like:  Temple, UConn and Rutgers...  BUT we aren't.  

However, on the flip side,  having to play programs like SMU, Tulsa, Memphis, Tulane, etc.. in all sports won't be all that novel after a couple years and will be expensive in terms of travel.

For now, it's great to be in the penthouse of the MAC conference and I'm enjoying it!

  

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To me a move to the AAC would be perfect however that comes with the idea that all the current teams stay. It's clearly a step up from the MAC. Yea travel expenses would be more but it's not so crazy geographically with UCONN Temple Cinci...

It's nice to have this conversation but it's going to take multiple years of success. BBall has been getting consistent (we'll see how this season goes) but one good year of football isn't enough. We need sustained success to be considered. I get that it's nice to be atop the MAC for now but the whole dream of everyone here and all UB athletics fans is to get to bigger and better places and start becoming one of those big sports schools. 

I was speaking to two guys in front of me at the Rutgers game who were talking about how they still don't get the full amount of money as the other BIG10 schools for another couple years and things have obviously been tough. Even my sister and her friends who went to Rutgers are all down on the fact that they don't win anymore. I 1000% disagree though. They literally completed the dream every mid-major has and made it to a P5 school. Yea, things will be tough and for a while but eventually the TV time, payouts, recruiting etc. is going to make their teams better. Now they at least have a chance (way) down the line to compete for a football national championship. THAT IS THE DREAM!!

To me a move to the AAC would be the most logical next step up. The quality of schools is way better, the competition and notoriety is better and would be a massive step to make this athletics program better. Whether or not the AAC feels Buffalo would fit is out of our hands but I don't understand how this wouldn't be the ideal situation to get bigger and better. The ultimate goal is likely for UB to somehow make it to the BIG10. Would make most sense geographically in a P5 conference (I guess maybe ACC but not really..) and the only way to start making moves towards that is to get in a better conference than we are now. No P5 school will ever take a school from the MAC.

These are the things I think about sitting in bed at night. Not saying we are necessarily worthy to move up yet...just that it's the dream.

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I took two trips east this year. One trip I drove from Buffalo to Cleveland. Another trip I drove from Cleveland to Grand Rapids, MI. Two similarly timed drives, but there is no denying Buffalo to Cleveland is boring. Your only major stopping place is Erie, and if you're a MAC man, there is no school or stadium to stop by on the way to the closest schools, Akron and Kent.

From Cleveland, you're solidly in MAC country: close to Akron and Kent, a few hours west, Toledo and BGSU. When I was at UB, everyone dreaded the six hour bus ride football took to BG or Toledo, but from Cleveland, you're flipping off the Toledo Rockets sign on the I-75 in what seems like no time. A few minutes north from Toledo, you start to see a lot of 'Block M' which let's you know you're close to clocking into the Factory. From Ypsi, you can get to WMU or CMU in about 90 minutes.

Anyway my trips made me think the MAC's divisional format is all wrong. Buffalo needs to be connected to EMU, via Canada, not to Kent and Akron, via Erie. BG and Toledo deserve to be together. You can't break up the Michigan trio. We need to embrace Miami and Ball State. 

So I created a grid-based Conference with 3 Quartets and 4 Divisons

                             North       South     West       East

Erie Quartet         EMU       BGSU   Toledo      UB
L Quartet              CMU      Miami   Ball St      Ohio
Snake Quartet     WMU     Kent       NIU          Akron

Each team would play their Division (2 games) and their Quartet (3 games) Then 2 predetermined games against a team from 2 other divisions, and a semi final/flex game against the third division.

I think you have a quartet champion, for braging rights, along with double the division race, technically making each season more meaningful. 

So UB would play in this scenario

Division:
1) Ohio
2) Akron 

Quartet:
3) EMU
4) BGSU
5) Toledo

Predetermined (vs South and West)

6) Ball State 
7) Miami

Semifinal/Flex (vs. North)
8. WMU (semifinal game)

MAC Championship
9) Winner of North vs East semi vs Winner of South vs West semi.

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10 hours ago, weareub46 said:

To me a move to the AAC would be perfect however that comes with the idea that all the current teams stay. It's clearly a step up from the MAC. Yea travel expenses would be more but it's not so crazy geographically with UCONN Temple Cinci...

It's nice to have this conversation but it's going to take multiple years of success. BBall has been getting consistent (we'll see how this season goes) but one good year of football isn't enough. We need sustained success to be considered. I get that it's nice to be atop the MAC for now but the whole dream of everyone here and all UB athletics fans is to get to bigger and better places and start becoming one of those big sports schools. 

I was speaking to two guys in front of me at the Rutgers game who were talking about how they still don't get the full amount of money as the other BIG10 schools for another couple years and things have obviously been tough. Even my sister and her friends who went to Rutgers are all down on the fact that they don't win anymore. I 1000% disagree though. They literally completed the dream every mid-major has and made it to a P5 school. Yea, things will be tough and for a while but eventually the TV time, payouts, recruiting etc. is going to make their teams better. Now they at least have a chance (way) down the line to compete for a football national championship. THAT IS THE DREAM!!

To me a move to the AAC would be the most logical next step up. The quality of schools is way better, the competition and notoriety is better and would be a massive step to make this athletics program better. Whether or not the AAC feels Buffalo would fit is out of our hands but I don't understand how this wouldn't be the ideal situation to get bigger and better. The ultimate goal is likely for UB to somehow make it to the BIG10. Would make most sense geographically in a P5 conference (I guess maybe ACC but not really..) and the only way to start making moves towards that is to get in a better conference than we are now. No P5 school will ever take a school from the MAC.

These are the things I think about sitting in bed at night. Not saying we are necessarily worthy to move up yet...just that it's the dream.

Over the years here at UBFAN, I have written many different versions of this same post...with names or conferences changed.

The first step is to win, consistently.

The second step is to be at the right place at the right time.  

Being successful at Step 1 increases the likelihood of Step 2.  But you can't get to Step 2 without Step 1.

Having followed UB sports (especially football and basketball) for almost 30 years, the two biggest things to happen to put UB on the path towards Step 1 was hiring Gill and Hurley.

The hug after the BSU MACC between Gill and Manuel...there should be a picture of that (large size) somewhere in Alumni.  It signified a step change.

Finally making the NCAA basketball tournament was another step change.

Now we have to win and win consistently.  Beating WVa in a true road game helps establish that consistency in many different ways.

Though I am not in Buffalo, I will wear my UB gear today proudly.

Go Bulls!

 

 

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, UB92 said:

Over the years here at UBFAN, I have written many different versions of this same post...with names or conferences changed.

The first step is to win, consistently.

The second step is to be at the right place at the right time.  

Being successful at Step 1 increases the likelihood of Step 2.  But you can't get to Step 2 without Step 1.

Having followed UB sports (especially football and basketball) for almost 30 years, the two biggest things to happen to put UB on the path towards Step 1 was hiring Gill and Hurley.

The hug after the BSU MACC between Gill and Manuel...there should be a picture of that (large size) somewhere in Alumni.  It signified a step change.

Finally making the NCAA basketball tournament was another step change.

Now we have to win and win consistently.  Beating WVa in a true road game helps establish that consistency in many different ways.

Though I am not in Buffalo, I will wear my UB gear today proudly.

Go Bulls!

 

 

 

 

 

I agree completely. This football season is monumental but it can’t just be a one and done for us to get to the next level. We will need continued success in the coming years. 

Bssketball has been pretttty consistent now. We’ll see what happens this year as it’s extremely important. That WVU win is a massive step in the right direction though. Let’s keep it up

Really need to knock off a bowl game win for football. I totally agree we aren’t at that consistent winning program but holy sh** it’s great to be a bull lately. LETS GO

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I honestly don't see the value of a "rivalry" in the MAC. I wouldn't anticipate that attendance would increase, and TV exposure wouldn't change either. So what's to be gained? As to changing conferences, UB is fine where it is. The MAC is favorable geographically (and thus financially) and a good fit in terms of talent. I used to obsess about the basketball team driving a change in conferences, thinking that our recent successes plus better competition in conferences other than the MAC would improve recruiting. But I now think that's a zero sum game (and obviously we can attract 4 star recruits). I vote to stay.

Edited by ubfan75
clarity
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