Jump to content
Buffalo Bulls - UB Fan Forum
Sign in to follow this  
Kevin

Jim Whitesell: First Season as HC

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, Tee4three said:

The home losses are what is concerning especially to teams that we are much better than. If those same losses happened on the road it wouldnt be as much of a red flag. I've seen improvement in the offense, would like to see the same on the defensive side too

But lets remember this team was going into the season with brock as its starter until at the last minute mballa received a wavier. How do we interpret that? That they expected this to be a throw away season? Or that the staff is in over their head? Id lean towards throw away season, with the level of recruits we have coming in next season

 

From a different perspective maybe the expectations for this team were too high. We lost our five main players from last year. The expectation was that Segu and Williams would take giant leaps forward, that Jordan and Graves would become our best players, Grant and Johnson would contribute either as starters or as depth players, Fagan and Bertram even though they played very little since being here were going to contribute. The main nucleus of the team has changed along with Coach Whitesell getting his footing again as a head coach.Do agree we have to give this team time and see if they can become a cohesive group. We will still support and cheer this team on and hope for improvement. The positives of course are Mballa and to some degree hope that Hardnettt and NIckelberry can become more comfortable as the year progresses. Go Bulls!!!!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will reiterate that this team needs to play with defensive intensity every game regardless of opponent.  There are still 17 MAC games for them to establish this mindset.

FWIW, I dug up the home losses from Oats' first year.  You could live with losses to Akron and possibly Toledo, but not so sure about the other two games.

Date Opponent Rank PF PA Deficit
1/5/2016 Akron 88 71 75 -4
2/9/2016 Toledo 123 69 71 -2
2/13/2016 Ohio 141 75 94 -19
3/1/2016 Miami (OH) 247 59 67 -8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Kevin said:

I have no idea what you are even talking about now. Who is my boy? 

I'd prefer we stick to the topic, Jim Whitesell coaching UB in year 1 so far. 

coach B

"Coach B" because you say the name so often if would be too cumbersome to have to say his full first or last name.

It is idiotic to try to draw any conclusions from a few games in a new coaches tenure.  Even worse to try to make any inference into recruiting following a turbulent off season where your slime ball boy was trying to burn the program down on his way out the door and telling recruits to avoid UB.

Anyone who continues to side with those slime balls in the way they handled themselves is not a friend of the program.  They actively worked against UB.  And not the way a rival program does (if you want to say Bama is a rival program) but the way a vindictive weasel does who is trying to extort something they want.  

Your boy wasn't hired and we are better off for it.  No matter how much you try to undermine the work by this staff.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does every thread have to devolve into personal arguments? Can you all just stick to discussing the topic of the thread? That's how threads/topics work.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said:

"Coach B" because you say the name so often if would be too cumbersome to have to say his full first or last name.

It is idiotic to try to draw any conclusions from a few games in a new coaches tenure.  Even worse to try to make any inference into recruiting following a turbulent off season where your slime ball boy was trying to burn the program down on his way out the door and telling recruits to avoid UB.

Anyone who continues to side with those slime balls in the way they handled themselves is not a friend of the program.  They actively worked against UB.  And not the way a rival program does (if you want to say Bama is a rival program) but the way a vindictive weasel does who is trying to extort something they want.  

Your boy wasn't hired and we are better off for it.  No matter how much you try to undermine the work by this staff.

You are completely off base, my guy.  Go check my threads from the search on Coach B.  We had one labeled "who is coach B employed by", one in which I sounded off on him for recruiting for Alabama. I'd appreciate you having facts (what you accused me of not having) before making random assumptions like that. 

"the work by the staff" is what we are discussing here, hence the point of this topic.

Once again, it's not about your fake assumptions on "my boy". 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Everyone just keep in mind that this is the guy who freaked the fuck out three games into Oats' first season.

He'll be sucking up to the Whitesell era a year or two from now when they're back in tourney form. Maybe even this year. Like clockwork.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm just hoping the critics of 1st season whitesell end up being as hilariously wrong as the people who were calling Oats out.... 

28712607_2020-01-0614_44_08-GameThreadForBuffaloBullsatSaintJosephsHawks-BullRun.thumb.png.028dacfbfb409d2f24904dbc1cd07382.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Jeseph said:

Why does every thread have to devolve into personal arguments? Can you all just stick to discussing the topic of the thread? That's how threads/topics work.

.........

6 minutes ago, Reverend_Goose said:

Everyone just keep in mind that this is the guy who freaked the fuck out three games into Oats' first season.

He'll be sucking up to the Whitesell era a year or two from now when they're back in tourney form. Maybe even this year. Like clockwork.

 

2 minutes ago, Bull_In_Exile said:

I'm just hoping the critics of 1st season whitesell end up being as hilariously wrong as the people who were calling Oats out.... 

28712607_2020-01-0614_44_08-GameThreadForBuffaloBullsatSaintJosephsHawks-BullRun.thumb.png.028dacfbfb409d2f24904dbc1cd07382.png

...Cool, thanks guys!

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Jeseph said:

.........

 

...Cool, thanks guys!

3lco68.jpg

Jeseph, I'm not personally attacking the guy... Pointing out that there is a history of some people jumping all over a coaching staff, that's all. If he's gonna come in here and rant that Whitesell is not the guy surely saying "well you've said that before"

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Jeseph said:

Why does every thread have to devolve into personal arguments? Can you all just stick to discussing the topic of the thread? That's how threads/topics work.

Do agree 100%. I was finally convinced by my kids and relatives to join the thread a number of years ago and being a proud, passionate UB supporter the last 30-50 years. Getting different opinions and perspectives and trying to separate fact from fiction and still being passionate without becoming too personal has been a challenge at times. Would only hope we can enjoy this UB thread without going off the rails. Go Bulls!!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Bull_In_Exile said:

Pointing out that there is a history of some people jumping all over a coaching staff, that's all.

If that's what you want to say that you're doing in this thread and that you feel that your post is a productive contribution to the thread, go for it I guess.

My point is that a thread was made about Whitesell's job so far this year. If people disagree with OPs original post it's far more interesting to have a discussion about the topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Jeseph said:

If that's what you want to say that you're doing in this thread and that you feel that your post is a productive contribution to the thread, go for it I guess.

 

Yes, I do feel like that's productive in a sports fan forum. No name calling, no back biting, just talking

 

Quote

My point is that a thread was made about Whitesell's job so far this year.

My take is that it was about Whitesell not being the right guy period and having a lackluster history at his past job... But maybe I read him wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Jeseph said:

If that's what you want to say that you're doing in this thread and that you feel that your post is a productive contribution to the thread, go for it I guess.

My point is that a thread was made about Whitesell's job so far this year. If people disagree with OPs original post it's far more interesting to have a discussion about the topic.

The post wasn't about the job being done this year.

The whole purpose was to make the claim that Jim shouldn't have been hired.  That is the whole reason for citing old states from another program  over a decade ago.

This is a person who is going to rail against the staff any chance they get.  But you don't have to believe me (or the others) you can simply sit back and watch it unfold anytime the team has any setback.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, Bull_In_Exile said:

I'm just hoping the critics of 1st season whitesell end up being as hilariously wrong as the people who were calling Oats out.... 

28712607_2020-01-0614_44_08-GameThreadForBuffaloBullsatSaintJosephsHawks-BullRun.thumb.png.028dacfbfb409d2f24904dbc1cd07382.png

Saying, long year ahead, I guess I haven't accepted that yet, isn't really that big of a comment. 

Also, pretty hypocritical to want to talk "basketball" when you and your site and your new cronies here, all blocked me on social media. So I did the same so you couldn't subtweet my stuff. 

Get out of here with just "basketball".

You only pop on to threads either A) I'm in or B) I start

Good try.

 

 

Edited by Kevin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said:

The post wasn't about the job being done this year.

The whole purpose was to make the claim that Jim shouldn't have been hired.  That is the whole reason for citing old states from another program  over a decade ago.

This is a person who is going to rail against the staff any chance they get.  But you don't have to believe me (or the others) you can simply sit back and watch it unfold anytime the team has any setback.

Did I say that he shouldn't have been hired? I said he hasn't been great thus far. Is that wrong? I said Grant wasn't good and he ended up getting his minutes almost removed. Was that wrong?

We are allowed to discuss the current coach, of this current basketball team, through his first half of a season.

We are using posts in from 2015 to try to prove a point, 5 years ago. Don't talk to me about "decade ago". 

Also, you have to let Bryan Hodgson go. I enjoy the work he did on the recruiting end, but I am not indebted to him. I was not interested in hiring him as the coach of this team.

I wanted a P5 assistant outside of the program.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Kevin said:

Saying, long year ahead, I guess I haven't accepted that yet, isn't really that big of a comment. Also, pretty hypocritical to want to talk "basketball" when you and your site and your new cronies here

 

3lcum3.jpg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Kevin said:

I just don't get the "rebuilding" argument. 

This coach, was hired, mostly because he was able to keep this team together and not lose any of the core that was built. The last I checked, Segu, Williams, Johnson,  Graves, Jordan, and to a lesser degree Fagan, Brock, and Grant were all here working with Whitesell last season and growing with the team.  This isn't a rebuild of failure which everyone was fired for underperforming. This was a promotion for a coach because of success. That's why he got this job. CONTINUITY and KNOWLEDGE of the team that's in place. He sure didn't get the job selling it as a rebuild to Alnutt.

But now we want it both ways where it's now a "rebuild" when it isn't going to plan. 

This team is coming off back to back seasons winning a game in the tournament and posting their best seasons ever. 

Teams like EMU and Miami lose like 3 starters to transfers every year, while keeping their coaches. This is rebuilding. No one wants to stay or play for these teams.

 

How many minutes did the guys that returned actually play last year? We lost 5 seniors you could argue 4 of them were all time great bulls. That is a lot. That isn't your average turn over in a program

Rebuilding is the wrong terminology in my opinion, this season has always been about keeping the ship headed in the right direction while getting key young pieces experience in leadership roles.

A great example of what the expectations for this team should be is Wichita State last year. They had lost a lot of talent but had a great in coming class and were young inexperienced everywhere. They started slow losing to teams they should beat and winning games they shouldn't. By the end of the season they started to put it together and made a run to the NIT semi's.

Tldr: this season isn't about the now, its about March, not because thats the only way we make the tournament but its the only way you can see if the team has progressed and where they are headed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Bull_In_Exile said:

3lcum3.jpg

 

You sited a random post from 2015 again. One that really wasn't that bad. 

If it read "Nate Oats sucked, I can't believe we hired that guy, we should have hired Bryan Hodgson" then sure.  It didn't. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Tee4three said:

How many minutes did the guys that returned actually play last year? We lost 5 seniors you could argue 4 of them were all time great bulls. That is a lot. That isn't your average turn over in a program

Rebuilding is the wrong terminology in my opinion, this season has always been about keeping the ship headed in the right direction while getting key young pieces experience in leadership roles.

A great example of what the expectations for this team should be is Wichita State last year. They had lost a lot of talent but had a great in coming class and were young inexperienced everywhere. They started slow losing to teams they should beat and winning games they shouldn't. By the end of the season they started to put it together and made a run to the NIT semi's.

Tldr: this season isn't about the now, its about March, not because thats the only way we make the tournament but its the only way you can see if the team has progressed and where they are headed

That's fine. I agree with some of those points.

My questions are this though: do you feel comfortable about this team in March? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Kevin said:

 

You only pop on to threads either A) I'm in or B) I start

 

You post in just about every hoops thread  guy, but I'll tell you what... Most of the time I don't notice but when you go full clown mode, and I was not the first to call you out here, I'll say something.

That being said, get over yourself, Where was I going after you in the following threads.

http://ubfan.com/bb/index.php?/profile/96-bull_in_exile/

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Bull_In_Exile said:

You post in just about every hoops thread  guy, but I'll tell you what... Most of the time I don't notice but when you go full clown mode, and I was not the first to call you out here, I'll say something.

That being said, get over yourself, Where was I going after you in the following threads.

Full clown mode is having a discussion about the current head coach of the team after a bad opening home MAC loss?

Yeah, makes sense. Completely on brand for UBPositiveOnlyRun.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Kevin said:

Full clown mode is having a discussion about the current head coach of the team after a bad opening home MAC loss?

Yeah, makes sense. Completely on brand for UBPositiveOnlyRun.com

No full clown mode is basing that opinion on the belief Loyola was a good basketball school before Whitesell and he somehow failed terribly there. Going back and editing it after getting called out does not cancel out just want a wrong take you had. I was not the first to call you on it here.

You have a history of this, and it appears you're one of those guys who don't learn from your mistakes. I'm more than able to admit when I don't know something.

>  UBPositiveOnlyRun.com

Is that supposed to be some kind of a sick burn? you sound more like Bucky and Sully every day. Quick, now put up a quip about blue tinted glasses and pom-poms..

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Bull_In_Exile said:

No full clown mode is basing that opinion on the belief Loyola was a good basketball school before Whitesell and he somehow failed terribly there. Going back and editing it after getting called out does not cancel out just want a wrong take you had. I was not the first to call you on it here.

You have a history of this, and it appears you're one of those guys who don't learn from your mistakes. I'm more than able to admit when I don't know something.

>  UBPositiveOnlyRun.com

Is that supposed to be some kind of a sick burn? you sound more like Bucky and Sully every day. Quick, now put up a quip about blue tinted glasses and pom-poms..

 

Nope. Not a sick burn. I'm waiting for you to post anything negative about basketball that you've said. I'm sure you'll try to find something.

I'm on local (hmm) air waves weekly talking positive about this program. Don't get it twisted. I come to these sites to try to talk about in-depth problems I see with this team/coaching because I expect to have a conversation from the perceived "best" and not have it hijacked by personal call outs. The one by @dutchcountry7 about Hodgson is just funny and wrong.

I know I live rent free in your mind with the 2014 and 2015 takes, but I'm not responding to you and your personal attacks anymore.

Good day. 

Edited by Kevin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, dutchcountry7 said:

It is idiotic to try to draw any conclusions from a few games in a new coaches tenure.  Even worse to try to make any inference into recruiting following a turbulent off season where your slime ball boy was trying to burn the program down on his way out the door and telling recruits to avoid UB.

Anyone who continues to side with those slime balls in the way they handled themselves is not a friend of the program.  They actively worked against UB.  And not the way a rival program does (if you want to say Bama is a rival program) but the way a vindictive weasel does who is trying to extort something they want.  

Your boy wasn't hired and we are better off for it.  No matter how much you try to undermine the work by this staff.

I've seen the bolded referenced a number of times on here for awhile; I've been a long-time lurker but didn't register until recently.  Can someone fill me in on the specifics here?  Private message is fine if you don't want to clutter the thread.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Kevin said:

That's fine. I agree with some of those points.

My questions are this though: do you feel comfortable about this team in March? 

I do. What ive seen is this team seems to get up for a challenge, minus the vandy game. They played well against uconn and beat DePaul mainly but the other non conference games as well.

The home losses are worrisome but I want to see them against a ball state team on the road. I watched ball state toledo, this is a game we should win

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...