Trust Vantrese??

[Chet]

It does not appear that this coaching staff trusts Vantrese. They don’t have the experienced o line to continue to the run the ball like they have in the past. I’m hopeful that the offense will continue to evolve. 

[RecoveringHillbilly]

I think they realize his successes like 14-6 as a starter, 2 bowls wins, low TO rate and has he been sacked twice in 3 seasons. I am hopeful it was just the case of a game-plan staying vanilla as the lead was large though it almost cost them this game. They likely want to save working new plays/showing an expanded playbook, for MAC play.

[mikescherrer8]

If they have no intentions of establishing a passing game, then why not just start Myers and have his athletic ability open up the playbook? It’s not hard for teams to figure out that we 7-8/10 times we just just gonna run the ball.

[Chet]

Time for a QB change. Offense didn’t do anything. 

[UB92]

7 minutes ago, Chet said:

Time for a QB change. Offense didn’t do anything. 

Yeah.  I thought this topic would be popular after today’s loss.  
 

Other defenses have committed to stop the run and have taken away anything else Vantrease can do.  
 

At least Myers is a running threat.  Time for a change.
 

They can’t go 4 straight 3 and outs late in the game like that.  
 

Gotta regroup and coach up Myers for the rest of the season.  
 

I was in the “keep Vantrease” camp at the start of the year, but it is clear we need something else with this team at the moment.  Garbage time TD not withstanding.  

[mikescherrer8]

Been saying it since before the season started and it’s evident now, start Matt Myers. If you’re going to have a non existent passing offense, at least start a guy who’s athletic and who can scramble.

Wasting away a season on a below average quarterback and running a predictable offense.

[UB77]

I think the disparity between first and second half offence performances reflect more on the coaching staff than the QB.

It's still a brand new staff and in game adjustments just don't seem to be there.

Yet?

[Chet]

29 minutes ago, UB77 said:

I think the disparity between first and second half offence performances reflect more on the coaching staff than the QB.

It's still a brand new staff and in game adjustments just don't seem to be there.

Yet?

Vantrese hasn’t been bad, just not enough plays are being made. Offense has really underperformed this season. 

[UBlearns]

35 minutes ago, UB77 said:

I think the disparity between first and second half offence performances reflect more on the coaching staff than the QB.

It's still a brand new staff and in game adjustments just don't seem to be there.

Yet?

This is where I'm at.  Huge regression on offense this season, and I really don't think Vantrease is the problem.  He has done what they've asked him to do all season to date.  I know they lost very important pieces on offense, and you have to expect a step back.  But it's really bad right now.  Maybe Matt Myers is the answer, I don't know, I'm not at practice all week like the coaches are.  But I'm already starting to wonder whether Shane Montgomery is the right guy at the OC position.

[Dabulls]

4 hours ago, UBlearns said:

This is where I'm at.  Huge regression on offense this season, and I really don't think Vantrease is the problem.  He has done what they've asked him to do all season to date.  I know they lost very important pieces on offense, and you have to expect a step back.  But it's really bad right now.  Maybe Matt Myers is the answer, I don't know, I'm not at practice all week like the coaches are.  But I'm already starting to wonder whether Shane Montgomery is the right guy at the OC position.

Head coaches and OCs I’d give a year. Hopefully they can implement there system with the right guys. I am concerned though that the offense seems too predictable, have to open up the playbook more.

[BullBoy]

4 hours ago, UBlearns said:

This is where I'm at.  Huge regression on offense this season, and I really don't think Vantrease is the problem.  He has done what they've asked him to do all season to date.  I know they lost very important pieces on offense, and you have to expect a step back.  But it's really bad right now.  Maybe Matt Myers is the answer, I don't know, I'm not at practice all week like the coaches are.  But I'm already starting to wonder whether Shane Montgomery is the right guy at the OC position.

I agree with this 100%. The play calling has been awful. We run it up the middle on first and second down and then put KVT in third and long every time. Look what happened in the fourth when they need to score. They let him throw long and he connected on some passes. Between the questionable play calling and the weak o-line, I don’t think the QB is the problem 

[UBlearns]

1 hour ago, Dabulls said:

Head coaches and OCs I’d give a year. Hopefully they can implement there system with the right guys. I am concerned though that the offense seems too predictable, have to open up the playbook more.

I'm certainly not expecting any sort of movement midseason - I meant more along the lines of evaluating for next year.  Coach Mo gets a multi-year leash to implement a system, his staff, his recruits.  But if the offense doesn't pick it up over the next 7 games, the offensive coaching staff should potentially be on the table.  We should expect better than 4 straight 3-and-outs in crunch time, in a 1-score game against an evenly-matched opponent.

[Kr632]

16 hours ago, UBlearns said:

This is where I'm at.  Huge regression on offense this season, and I really don't think Vantrease is the problem.  He has done what they've asked him to do all season to date.  I know they lost very important pieces on offense, and you have to expect a step back.  But it's really bad right now.  Maybe Matt Myers is the answer, I don't know, I'm not at practice all week like the coaches are.  But I'm already starting to wonder whether Shane Montgomery is the right guy at the OC position.

Vantrease is a huge problem. He's been struggling to make very easy throws. He's rarely on time and his accuracy is all over the place. Some balls sail over the receivers head some fall a few yards short. He throws off his back foot in clean pockets. A change needs to be made 

[BullBoy]

16 minutes ago, Kr632 said:

Vantrease is a huge problem. He's been struggling to make very easy throws. He's rarely on time and his accuracy is all over the place. Some balls sail over the receivers head some fall a few yards short. He throws off his back foot in clean pockets. A change needs to be made 

I totally get where everyone is coming from... But I also think a lot of this is our terrible offensive line.. By far the worst line we've had in five years.. Look at how bad Marks has regressed.

[Dabulls]

12 hours ago, UBlearns said:

I'm certainly not expecting any sort of movement midseason - I meant more along the lines of evaluating for next year.  Coach Mo gets a multi-year leash to implement a system, his staff, his recruits.  But if the offense doesn't pick it up over the next 7 games, the offensive coaching staff should potentially be on the table.  We should expect better than 4 straight 3-and-outs in crunch time, in a 1-score game against an evenly-matched opponent.

I meant to say a few years not a year. 💯 agree with your statement. Once he gets his recruits in here that fit his system I believe we will be fine. Trying to implement a new system with players that are not his recruits in such a little timetable is tough. Just have to play and adjust game to game

[Dabulls]

2 hours ago, BullBoy said:

I totally get where everyone is coming from... But I also think a lot of this is our terrible offensive line.. By far the worst line we've had in five years.. Look at how bad Marks has regressed.

They’re very young and inexperienced. They don’t look all that bad for having new faces

[CheerUB80/84]

The most popular player (for fans) on a struggling team is the back up quarterback 

[UBinMD]

1 hour ago, CheerUB80/84 said:

The most popular player (for fans) on a struggling team is the back up quarterback 

Frank Reich

[clodney]

Vantrease is a Tyrod Taylor type of QB - smart, protects the ball, but isn't going to do anything flashy or carry the team to victories on his own. Perhaps Matt Myers will add an element that would help us move the ball but I put very little blame on Vantrease for our current offensive woes. The problem is our run game.

I'm no expert but wasn't the success of our run game last year based on a lot of zone blocking and stretch plays? Everyone was in motion on every snap, yet now we seem to be playing a more basic handoff up the middle type of game and our linemen are struggling to open gaps, let alone reach the second level. Why not switch up the playcalling to something this team is a bit more familiar with? This feels a bit like Jeff Quinn's first year as a HC where he committed to his strategy without considering the personnel he inherited. I'm not sure what the answer is but it feels to me that it's more important that we fix our run game to open things up for our strong-armed QB instead of switching to our running QB to supplement our lack of a rushing attack.

[MKBullsfan]

10 hours ago, clodney said:

Vantrease is a Tyrod Taylor type of QB - smart, protects the ball, but isn't going to do anything flashy or carry the team to victories on his own. Perhaps Matt Myers will add an element that would help us move the ball but I put very little blame on Vantrease for our current offensive woes. The problem is our run game.

I'm no expert but wasn't the success of our run game last year based on a lot of zone blocking and stretch plays? Everyone was in motion on every snap, yet now we seem to be playing a more basic handoff up the middle type of game and our linemen are struggling to open gaps, let alone reach the second level. Why not switch up the playcalling to something this team is a bit more familiar with? This feels a bit like Jeff Quinn's first year as a HC where he committed to his strategy without considering the personnel he inherited. I'm not sure what the answer is but it feels to me that it's more important that we fix our run game to open things up for our strong-armed QB instead of switching to our running QB to supplement our lack of a rushing attack.

And we lost our 2 best starting linemen to transfer Gall to Baylor and Novitsky to Kansas. That didn’t help. 

[UB92]

2 hours ago, MKBullsfan said:

And we lost our 2 best starting linemen to transfer Gall to Baylor and Novitsky to Kansas. That didn’t help. 

All of it (losing our coach, losing the two best starting linemen and losing JP) makes us a worse running team.  That running game, obviously, hid the "game manager" that Vantrease was (and he did a fine job in that role).

We don't have that running game now and need more out of Vantrease -- and he really doesn't have that (as far as I can tell).  What we lose in moving to Myers in the passing game (and game management), we can hopefully make up for (and more) in his ability to run (and use the RPO effectively).   That's what I would like to see, but unless I missed something, I don't believe the coach has a made a change yet.

I wonder if Myers is seeing more reps in practice and/or if he will bring him in for some series this week.

 

[121Merrimac]

If Marks isn’t able to run this year (like he could last year), then why do people think that Myers will be able too?   The OL is still missing those same pieces from last year.   I don’t see the point in blaming any one player, or position group for that matter.   It is a team sport after all.   Now that I type it out, I feel that if the running game isn’t working, then the last thing you’d want to do is add another running element to the mix.  Wouldn’t you want to keep the best passer on the field, to balance things out?

[mikescherrer8]

14 hours ago, 121Merrimac said:

If Marks isn’t able to run this year (like he could last year), then why do people think that Myers will be able too?

His athleticism opens up more options, it allows the coaching staff to try different things within an option style offense, running a more effective RPO style offense. With Kyle, you aren’t able to get that. With Myers, and THREE running backs? It creates endless possibilities. Vantrease has been shown to be nothing more than a game manager. Especially this season. When he is under center, the offense is both predictable and uninspiring. So why not try Myers? Why not try to make adjustments and to fix what is clearly broken. It’s better than sticking with what they are currently doing which is basically rolling over and surrendering meaningful drives. They should have had that figured out over the summer but here they are heading into their 6th game at a crossroads. If you want to witness Buffalo continuing down the path they are in, be my guest. Me however, I want to see a change, and I think everyone here should be open to it. 

[121Merrimac]

26 minutes ago, mikescherrer8 said:

… If you want to witness Buffalo continuing down the path they are in, be my guest… 

Nope, I was just asking the question.  I’m all for having more options.  I didn’t even mean to imply keeping KVT, if one of the younger QBs is more accurate.  Just wanted to bring the OL back into the conversation.   Won’t qb scramble, delayed run type plays require them to hold on longer than they currently do… and, are they up for it? 

[UBinMD]

2 hours ago, 121Merrimac said:

Nope, I was just asking the question.  I’m all for having more options.  I didn’t even mean to imply keeping KVT, if one of the younger QBs is more accurate.  Just wanted to bring the OL back into the conversation.   Won’t qb scramble, delayed run type plays require them to hold on longer than they currently do… and, are they up for it? 

Sometimes it actually takes pressure off the OL since unpredictability slows the DL and pass rushers so they don’t get blown by. Myers can throw, he’s just not been asked to do so. I can’t speak to his accuracy vs KVT, but in our current offense with the running and RPO, we need 5-10 yard passes typically so I would like to think he could be highly efficient with that.

The conservative LL staff felt he was their best option until he got hurt. I’m willing to give it a go because the current offensive scheme looks eerily similar to mid-level HS programs for the last 6 quarters barring the junk TD