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Kevin

Jim Whitesell: First Season as HC

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We weren’t going to win out. It’s that simple. We were due for a clunker. One thing about this team is we have responded after loses. So let’s see how we respond. At this point in the season coaching becomes huge bc you are seeing teams a 2nd and possibility 3rd time. Let’s see how everyone responds. Who steps up in what may be Jeenathan’s absence. Let’s hope that Ohio was just a clunker and not the beginning of a spiral. We have 3 games left to continue to grow and get better before it’s due or die. Everyone must step up. It’s that time of the year. 

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On 2/19/2020 at 7:55 PM, skrabukes said:

Anyone predicting 13-5 heading into the season was really thinking pretty positively. 13 wins in this league isn't easy. Just because we got 16 last year and Akron had 17 a few year's back, doesn't mean that 13 wins is a given for anyone. The talent levels are much closer than most think in the MAC. A 67% win percentage only gets you to 12 wins, and winning 2 out of every 3 is no small feat, especially the year after graduating 4 All-MAC players. Beyond Jordan and Graves getting solid minutes over their careers here, and AJ getting good minutes 2 years ago (and sitting out all last year), this team didn't have a lot of game play experience at the D-1 level. Mballa, Williams, Segu didn't play very much last year. Grant didn't play tons at Houston 2 years ago (again, sitting out all last year). Hardnett sat out all last year, Brock has sparingly played, Nickelberry from JUCO last year and Memphis beforehand, and Gallion is a newcomer. The players now have gained a great deal of experience over the course of the season and are gelling at the right time, getting their defensive games in order and growing with each other. If you want to knock the coaches, you're crazy. If you don't think that this team is far better now than earlier in the season, you're even crazier. While all teams have the goal of getting better throughout the season, it doesn't always happen. Injuries, fatigue, in-house drama, etc. occur hindering growth. This team is definitely looking like a team ready to roll as opposed to ready for the season to end.

Reasonable. But weren’t people saying pre season that this team would have more depth and potentially nearly as good as last years team. I know there were a lot of extremely optimistic pre season outlooks. Now we’ve seen these guys be world beaters to a low mid one would have to say the season has been a successful one. A few more wins would go a long long way. 

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8 hours ago, Jeseph said:

Every post that doesn't celebrate the team is a call for pitchforks and torches.

Every post that celebrates the team is a call for a JW statue.

This is the truth. 

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Another double digit home loss. Smoked by a team missing one of their top scorers and dominated by a single player.

excellent improvement!

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4 minutes ago, Jeseph said:

Another double digit home loss. Smoked by a team missing one of their top scorers and dominated by a single player.

excellent improvement!

Do we have more home MAC loses under Whitesell than the last three years combined? 
 

it’s hard to see the growth plan here 

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4 minutes ago, Jeseph said:

Another double digit home loss. Smoked by a team missing one of their top scorers and dominated by a single player.

excellent improvement!

To be fair it was a very close game until a couple bad swings at the end caused the blowout. The biggest issues IMO:

- Graves was cold. Missed plenty of shots he normally makes, was slipping on the floor again causing turnovers

- Segu struggled trying to cover Jackson. Jordan out with 4 fouls was a killer.

- too much driving wildly to the net and chucking up prayer layups. Johnson seems to do this quite a bit and can’t seem to draw fouls on them. Caruthers is the only guy I’ve ever seen to do this regularly and pull it off. 

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3 minutes ago, Kevin said:

Do we have more home MAC loses under Whitesell than the last three years combined? 
 

it’s hard to see the growth plan here 

Do you think with Oats and this roster we’d have more success? I’m not sure we would, Whitesell plays VERY similar to the way Nate did. We lost 5 of our best, most experienced players. If we still look like this next season with Williams, Segu, and Mballa as juniors and Graves as a senior I’ll agree with you. 

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5 minutes ago, UB05 said:

Do you think with Oats and this roster we’d have more success? I’m not sure we would, Whitesell plays VERY similar to the way Nate did. We lost 5 of our best, most experienced players. If we still look like this next season with Williams, Segu, and Mballa as juniors and Graves as a senior I’ll agree with you. 

I love Oats, but I agree I don't think we would be that much better with him if we had this same roster. Last year Alabama was 18-16 (8-10), this year they are 15-13 (7-8). A coach can only do so much without Top 25 level talent that we had last year.

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Whitesell is playing a similar style to Oates, but I'm becoming worried he doesn't know how to coach within that style.

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6 minutes ago, UB05 said:

Do you think with Oats and this roster we’d have more success?

My answer is a loud yes. Here’s why...1) we have 2 games left and Whitesell is still tinkering with the starting lineup. Which takes to point 2) our rotation is still a question mark. There’s no rhyme or reason as to who comes off the bench and when and for how long. Whitesell seems to be grasping for answers. As a result our defense suffers bc there’s no cohesion. 3) he makes very questionable in game decisions...example under 5 minutes left in today’s game and Jordan and Mballa are on the bench?! You play them despite the 4 fouls. Defensive liabilities shouldn’t be on the floor when the game is 73-71. That’s coaching. 4) no improvement throughout the season against things like the zone defense. Again that’s coaching. 
 

Some things fall on the players sure. If we don’t have a go to guy or a leader that’s on the players for no stepping up rather than the coach. The lack of focus and fire is on the players. But then again maybe we don’t have a go to guy bc the coaches don’t put the team in the best position to win. This team in a week reverted back to the team we were in January. Just when I thought we were peaking. 

At this point we are who we are and that’s an inconsistent team.

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1 hour ago, DooleyBull06 said:

My answer is a loud yes. Here’s why...1) we have 2 games left and Whitesell is still tinkering with the starting lineup. Which takes to point 2) our rotation is still a question mark. There’s no rhyme or reason as to who comes off the bench and when and for how long. Whitesell seems to be grasping for answers. As a result our defense suffers bc there’s no cohesion. 3) he makes very questionable in game decisions...example under 5 minutes left in today’s game and Jordan and Mballa are on the bench?! You play them despite the 4 fouls. Defensive liabilities shouldn’t be on the floor when the game is 73-71. That’s coaching. 4) no improvement throughout the season against things like the zone defense. Again that’s coaching. 
 

Some things fall on the players sure. If we don’t have a go to guy or a leader that’s on the players for no stepping up rather than the coach. The lack of focus and fire is on the players. But then again maybe we don’t have a go to guy bc the coaches don’t put the team in the best position to win. This team in a week reverted back to the team we were in January. Just when I thought we were peaking. 

At this point we are who we are and that’s an inconsistent team.

Good post

I was wondering why at least mballa wasn't in the game; I get you want him for the final minute or 2 but whitesell waited too long to bring him back. Brock was getting murdered on screens

We got out coached today; Groce made good adjustments without cheese and had a game plan that attacked our weaknesses

We have sucked vs a zone defense for a couple seasons now, not just a this year thing(which does point to the coaches as they have been here). I was always surprised more teams didn't play it against us last year

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12 minutes ago, Tee4three said:

Good post

I was wondering why at least mballa wasn't in the game; I get you want him for the final minute or 2 but whitesell waited too long to bring him back. Brock was getting murdered on screens

We got out coached today; Groce made good adjustments without cheese and had a game plan that attacked our weaknesses

We have sucked vs a zone defense for a couple seasons now, not just a this year thing(which does point to the coaches as they have been here). I was always surprised more teams didn't play it against us last year

We did beat both Syracuse and EMU last year. Plus teams that don’t zone tend not to run it just for poops bc they will get burned. Except this year we can’t even burn teams that don’t play it when they deploy it against us. Coaching.

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4 minutes ago, DooleyBull06 said:

We did beat both Syracuse and EMU last year. Plus teams that don’t zone tend not to run it just for poops bc they will get burned. Except this year we can’t even burn teams that don’t play it when they deploy it against us. Coaching.

Just because we won doesn't mean we didn't struggle against it. In the syracuse game our defense won that game. If I remember correctly we were down 10 at the half and held cuse scoreless in the final 4 minutes to win. And the game against emu there, we were down for bit until turnovers and fast break points beat them down

But yeah this year teams just throw it at us because they know it will work, which does point towards coaching. And it is maddening

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6 hours ago, Erie County said:

Was there a tweet today about losing due to how many games they played in how many days? 

I fail to understand why someone who considers themselves a "UB fan" would constantly knock the school/team/coaches. It's one thing to be critical of them, but the never ending downing of them doesn't make sense to me. How does putting them down with every single post help in the efforts? Have you bought tickets and been at every game getting behind the team, donated to the athletics fund to try to allow for increased opportunities, etc? Instead of constantly pushing your negatives, how about trying to help out in some way?

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5 hours ago, skrabukes said:

I fail to understand why someone who considers themselves a "UB fan" would constantly knock the school/team/coaches. It's one thing to be critical of them, but the never ending downing of them doesn't make sense to me. How does putting them down with every single post help in the efforts? Have you bought tickets and been at every game getting behind the team, donated to the athletics fund to try to allow for increased opportunities, etc? Instead of constantly pushing your negatives, how about trying to help out in some way?

I'm upset at how they handled the offseason and hire.

I have season tickets and I have for awhile now. I live near campus and all I want is the team to continue their path of winning, instead of having the locals care more about Bonaventure. There isn't one requirement to how to be a sports fan or UB fan. I think plenty of others have commented that there isn't a right way to root for a team. Your way isn't the only way.

Help out in which way? To give them more money for keeping coach Bryan Hodgson (like the Murchie's wanted to do) and have them retain hiring services, in order to hire their worst (IMHO) assistant coach?

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The thing that bothers me more than anything this year is that even after losses, all the players put up highlights on social media within hours after a loss. When I was growing up playing sports I would never do that. Maybe it is just how college kids are now though.

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2 minutes ago, SGBull said:

The thing that bothers me more than anything this year is that even after losses, all the players put up highlights on social media within hours after a loss. When I was growing up playing sports I would never do that. Maybe it is just how college kids are now though.

I think that's just how it is now (your last line). I'm with you, I never would've been like that either. Changing times. 

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3 hours ago, skrabukes said:

I think that's just how it is now (your last line). I'm with you, I never would've been like that either. Changing times. 

Do agree that the sport culture has changed dramatically. I look at the fact when players are posting their stats even after losses they are thinking more like individuals not thinking of the team first attitude. Our family does not like when a player makes a shot and makes a gesture or yells something to the opposing bench. Also when we went to the Bona/Duquesne game a Duquesne player after Duquesne had the game in hand was yelling and gesturing toward the Bona students and fans and was being held back by the Duquesne coaches but kept going toward the fans and he did that running all the way from the court. We were brought up playing sports to be humble in victory. Again we love the college game and continue to support  our UB teams. Truly changing times and hope for a win against Miami on Tuesday. Go Bulls!!!!

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It shouldn't be an issue if someone is upset at the hire of whitesell, but what is the reason a good number of people think hodgson would have been a better hire? The guy has never been a head coach at any level. I think he will get a shot one day but is no where near ready.

Everyone wants to see the path that ub athletics and basketball in particular is headed continue but a Hodgson hire would have been a huge risk of making us look like a joke

In my opinion the guy that people should be upset that we didn't hire got hired at Georgia st. Rob Lanier. Has ties to the area, has power/major conference ties has been a head coach and can recruit.

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23 hours ago, Tee4three said:

It shouldn't be an issue if someone is upset at the hire of whitesell, but what is the reason a good number of people think hodgson would have been a better hire? The guy has never been a head coach at any level. I think he will get a shot one day but is no where near ready.

Everyone wants to see the path that ub athletics and basketball in particular is headed continue but a Hodgson hire would have been a huge risk of making us look like a joke

In my opinion the guy that people should be upset that we didn't hire got hired at Georgia st. Rob Lanier. Has ties to the area, has power/major conference ties has been a head coach and can recruit.

Exactly. Well said. 

Many on here think I was Hodgson's PR department. 

I was team Rob Lanier from the start and I have sources on good accounts that said he was our top candidate. He however was always going to go to Georgia State. I do believe Alnutt's hands were tied with brining in an external candidate at Oats' salary range.

Instead we keep the 1M in the bank and wont even use it for a CBI or CIT. 

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43 minutes ago, Kevin said:

Exactly. Well said. 

Many on here think I was Hodgson's PR department. 

I was team Rob Lanier from the start and I have sources on good accounts that said he was our top candidate. He however was always going to go to Georgia State. I do believe Alnutt's hands were tied with brining in an external candidate at Oats' salary range.

Instead we keep the 1M in the bank and wont even use it for a CBI or CIT. 

If Lanier was here and had a similar record to Whitesell, would people here be jumping all over him? I mean, Georgia State is only 18-12 this season (had 28 and 24 wins the last 2 seasons), so how is that any different than this year's UB record of 18-11? I don't know Georgia State or him well enough to question him or praise him, but I still prefer to stand by the coaches and players that are on UB.

Surely we all wish they were winning everything, but all we as UB fans can do is support our team. No one here (as far as I am aware) is able to make any decisions on hiring/firing/transfer/etc. so backing our squad is the best that we can give, unless we are either a) fair-weather fans or b) bandwagon hoppers. Since I was here as a student, athlete and now old guy in the stands at every game, I prefer to simply support the blue and white (or black or grey - yuck).

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On 3/1/2020 at 1:28 PM, Tee4three said:

It shouldn't be an issue if someone is upset at the hire of whitesell, but what is the reason a good number of people think hodgson would have been a better hire? The guy has never been a head coach at any level. I think he will get a shot one day but is no where near ready.

Everyone wants to see the path that ub athletics and basketball in particular is headed continue but a Hodgson hire would have been a huge risk of making us look like a joke

In my opinion the guy that people should be upset that we didn't hire got hired at Georgia st. Rob Lanier. Has ties to the area, has power/major conference ties has been a head coach and can recruit.

The only thing Hodgson would have done is likely keep most of not all of the recruits. Whether that would have made a difference no one can say just like if he or Whitesell would be the more successful coach. 
 

My concern is when turnover occurs and success isn’t maintained it’s far easier to fall back to Reggie ball than the success UB enjoyed the last six years. That’s why this year despite the turnover has always been a critical one. Let’s hope we have a run in us!

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The jury is still out on Whitesell. That said, I look at Conference games and can point to 2, possibly 3, stinkers: the first Ball St game, the second Ohio game, and the meltdown in the last 5 minutes of the second Akron game. While team free throw shooting has improved, team rebounding in the last two games has suffered - both losses at a critical period of the season. Three point shooting has been inconsistent but generally poor. I don’t think that Buffalo’s defense scares anyone. Kenpom, from November through March, has had 5 different MAC teams going to March Madness: Ball St, Toledo, Kent, Bowling Green, and Akron. He’s had them anywhere from a 12th seed to a 15th seed. In other words, this thing is up for grabs. I would be surprised if Western Michigan won it all...and that’s about it.

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11 hours ago, UB85 said:

The only thing Hodgson would have done is likely keep most of not all of the recruits. Whether that would have made a difference no one can say just like if he or Whitesell would be the more successful coach. 
 

My concern is when turnover occurs and success isn’t maintained it’s far easier to fall back to Reggie ball than the success UB enjoyed the last six years. That’s why this year despite the turnover has always been a critical one. Let’s hope we have a run in us!

Right to have that concern, getting to Cleveland and winning a game there would be huge for the continuation of the program

I'm hoping I get to drive to cleveland March 14th

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