bull_trojan

9 minutes ago, ChubbyHubby said:

My concern with Turner Battle is that he's bring the Reggie style of play back to UB. 

Agreed, UB's pace was 16th in the nation. UAB's 297th. I want to keep playing fast.

Just now, ed said:

And putting that aside, you think $2.6M is cheaping out on a coach? There's only about 20 schools that pay more than $3M, and a handful above $4M. How much more do you think they should pay, and why?

Well who is getting more than 2.6 M in the PAC 12?
Oregon - Utah - Arizona.

So the premier team in the conference pays 4th.

USC doesn't disclose but they are probably in the neighborhood. ASU pays Hurley 2.1 million.

UB went to the round of 32 and we moved to make Oats the highest paid guy in the conference. UCLA goes to final fours and they are OK with their coaches being paid 4th/5th in conference

1 hour ago, ed said:

so your position is ucla sucks because they won't spend more than $8M on a coach.  wow. 

I'm biased, but there are schools that will figure out what everyone is paying and add a zero and there are schools like UCLA that figure out what everyone else is paying and remove a zero and then say you should be happy to work here for a paycut. 

They offered a coach a 1.2 million paycut to move to a higher cost of living city and rebuild a program instead of staying at his program that is on elite 8 autopilot. That doesn't scream power move... to me it looks like they offered it to show they are willing to spend, all the while hoping he declined the offer...they can then hire someone for cheap but tell there fans we didn't cheap out, we offered someone 8 million.

35 minutes ago, ed said:

uh, you really think ucla's recent woes (see above) have anything to do with spending?

Yes. They paid their old coach 2.6 million. They offered Coach Calipari 8 million a year, problem is it's 1.2 million LESS than what he currently makes. So either they don't have the resources to compete with Kentucky, or they have the resources and they are cheap. 

6 hours ago, BrooklynBull said:

That is assuming UB would get a full share immediately and did you calculate a smaller slice as the pie would be split up more ways?

No I actually didn’t count trips to UConn as I see a UConn exit as our most likely path in...

It’s a dilemma but there is no real honest principled reason to give a new team a smaller share. I’d reject any offer to join a conference that wouldn’t give a full share immediately 

1 hour ago, weareub46 said:

It would be tough/impossible to travel to games in places like UCF and Houston for most but I think anyone would be more inclined to take a road trip to a game @UCONN or @Cinci than any of the MAC schools 

UCF = Disney... easier to convince the family to let me go.

I think the American is an imperfect solution to the fact that our alumni base is more east coast than mid-west. Using LinkedIn Alumni I count 10,419 alumni in the AAC footprint if you don't count NYC, 35,866 if you do. I count only 3,315 for the MAC footprint. 

I did rough math on a AAC Basketball conference schedule vs the MAC, and I came up with AAC 46k more expensive...I rounded that up to 50k, mulitplied that by every sport minus Wrestling, and put 300k for football and came up with 900k.

Which, with the old AAC contract, would have left UB about 450k in the hole. With the new deal, we'd still come out +5.2 million.

2007 Jacobs here what up!

1) We lived through the worst, and even our most uninspired times (i.e. quinn) we haven't gone backwards. So that keeps me happy, we've stumbled, but we've moved forward, faster than I thought possible.

2) Win. In the era before us, there was nothing to capture hearts and minds. We had the '05 Basketball team and the '08 Football team. This year will capture a lot more, eventually it will be enough.

3) Personally, I think every fan and donor should be pushing for a plan...if we had a plan, I don't think we'd feel so lost...even if the plan said we'd get our arena renovated in 2030 we'd at least know we're working towards a goal...if our goals were Fieldhouse -> retain coaches ->???, we're now: done -> failed - > ????, and that's a very rough place to be.

11 hours ago, DooleyBull06 said:

I’m done with the whole Gonzaga of the East. The person who was going to lead us to becoming that is now in Alabama where Alabama will become the Kentucky of the South.

Gonzaga of the East is an aspiration...that's like saying I'm done being top 25 that was Oats' thing. Be done with the Blue Collar shirts. We're a University not a trade school.

11 hours ago, ed said:

ucla is a highly desirable job that has the resources to grab almost who ever they want, even if they already have a cushy job.  and even with their crappy years, they can recruit.  they don't have to have the same sense of urgency we do.  

UCLA has the resources to grab almost who ever they want, but they won't SPEND the resources on Athletics that's why they suck.

10 hours ago, BullBoy said:

Hodgson acted like a child during this whole event.. I wouldn't return his call either.

Neither an endorsement nor a denouncement of Hodgson, but I wouldn't make decisions based on emotion. Reminds me of when NIU told noted row enthusiast and alum P.J. Fleck to go elsewhere (because he had previously signed to be OC and then quit after a day to go NFL) worked out well for Fleck and WMU, not as well for NIU.

4 hours ago, Kevin said:

UB will use - Parker Executive Search

Alnutt was hired via Parker...so this was...expected.

At this point, if you're not going quick trigger on an existing coach, you might as well wait out this weekend in Minnesota where every coach in the nation will be and interview anyone who may be interested.

I think the old PSU coach made 700k, which is nice change. I'd hope she'd hold out for something a little better basketball wise, although a lot of NYers have love for Penn St so idk...

6 hours ago, dutchcountry7 said:

We all thought that coaching staff had class.  We are now realizing that they were classless.  It is worse than just having them hired away.  It is like they never even wanted to be here and didn't care for the people here.

If that is the case, we could at least as a fanbase have grace.

4 hours ago, rma said:

Has an AD ever done this at UB?  I'd rather they look for the next guy rather than get roasted by the media.

Anything he says would be boiler plate. This is just something fans complain about, but at the end of the day, either we'll be happy with the hire or upset with the hire and nothing in between will matter much.

1 hour ago, weareub46 said:

Not going to lie. Watching TT derail Michigan exactly like they did to us felt good. It wasn’t the same kind of shutdown against Gonzaga but man it def takes a little bit more of the sting away knowing we lost to a final 4 team 

I blame the committee. We never should have played them 2nd round in a 6-3 matchup because we should have been a 4/5 and Texas Tech should have been a 2. 

Then they put the game 4-6 hours outside of Tech's fanbase. Stinks

4 hours ago, ed said:

If you have marriage and family problems from sticking with a $800k job, your wife and kids suck. 

(My wife and I have discussed opportunities I've had where I can make an extra 6 figures every 4 months. She doesn't pressure me to do it (the opposite in fact - it involves being away and she prefers me home). 

That said, the Bama job probably is more money AND likely more time with the family. Less grinding for recruits at the P5 level. Less road games in the non-conference season. More staff for administrative tasks. Private plane at your disposal means any travel away from home is quicker and more convenient.

Everyone focuses on the money, but if I was going to pitch Oats and family, I would pitch him on our resources allowing him to compete at the same level while freeing him up for 10-20 hours a week of more family time. 

36 minutes ago, weareub46 said:

Maybe I don’t really know what I’m talking about but I feel like there should be a way that SUNY can equally support all of its schools academicaly but focus its support for athletics on the obvious choice. 

Not sure how the money flows between SUNY and the schools but don’t you think if a school like UB became bigger athletically and started making a good chunk more money some of it would flow back to the SUNY system? 

I dove into that world a bit when NY almost paid Cuse for a new dome. But it just seems to be a voters game.

When NY state has 54 million to give to WNY for sports, they get more bang for their buck "saving" the Bills than they would by building a field house, a rec center and renovating Alumni at UB.

In Central NY despite being private, if you want to please the voters via sports, you put money into the Orange. 

On long island, you build Stony a stadium.

In the city you take care of the pro sports... MSG has a tax exemption larger than UB's annual budget. Barclays took 9 figures of state funds.

In Utica they get 22 million for the Nexus Center ice rink...

So I think until we get a following that is politically significant, we'll continue to get little to no help on that front.

27 minutes ago, bull_trojan said:

Best solution is to be good at both. We did that this year.

I'd add that between 2006-07 and 2010-11:

Men's Basketball's record was 81-77 (.513), with 1 MAC Champ appearance (loss).
Total attendance was 232,741.

Football went 22-40 (.355) with 1 MAC Championship.
Total attendance was 356,966.

Between 2014-15 and 2018-19

Men's Basketball's record was 119-53 (.692), with 4 MAC Championships. 
Total attendance was 261,881.
Win% increased by 34.89%, attendance improved by 12.52%

Football went 28-33 (.459) with 1 MAC Champ appearance (loss).
Total attendance was 356,966.
Win% increased by 29.30%, attendance improved by 48.05%

So both programs are improving and selling better, but Football attendance is improving faster despite less success....

6 hours ago, bmb2jn said:

I've been hearing on the radio and podcasts (WGR, trainwreck sports) that the Football program hurts the Basketball program. That the money used on the Football team (for things like the field house etc....) is why we can't pay Oats & Hurly. 

Any truth to this? Any way to solve this problem? Or does UB have to pick one or the other?

Best solution is to be good at both. We did that this year.

Interview: What do you bring to the table.

Hodgson: Well I can bring talent. In fact, our #1 recruit has told me he will stay with Buffalo if I'm hired before he makes his decision on Saturday.

That is not leverage or extortion...

At this point he has no "leverage" but would still presumably take the UB job over the Bama assistant job, for obvious reasons. 

Facing tranfers and decommits, UB would be derelict in duty not to ask every candidate about who they think they can bring in to keep the team going in 19-20 and beyond.

I think a lot of the negativity stems from us being more used to the bottom 25 than the top 25.

Post Reggie, it was like who is really gonna come to UB and be an upgrade.  Answer was a hungry ex-Duke star, and a really good undiscovered high school coach.

Post Oats, who wouldn't want to come to UB. 6k fans, media attention, proven ability to build a "Gonzaga of the East" OR "Get your resume right for the P5"

I like the idea of Lanier and Oliver coming home from Tennessee together. I didn't know their story, but if we could get both of them together, that would be a great sign as far as their willingness to build... 

If Lanier came and Oliver didn't I'd be a little concerned that it's just a rental.

Amazing that since 2001 in Football and M. Basketball, we've only had 8 coaches

Hofher -> Gill -> Quinn -> Lance

Spoon -> Hurley -> Oats - > New person

In the overall scheme of things that's pretty good...especially as 3 of the last 4 departures were to major jobs and not firings...

In that time Pitt had 5 Football coaches and 4 Basketball Coaches despite being major...

And I think we had a better Football and Basketball season this year than the Panthers.

I want a thread free of bashing Oats, and crying about the situation... where we can just talk about the upcoming coaching search. 

I'd ask @admin for assistance in moderating this thread to keep it positive. Negativity can go to one of the existing threads.

UConn not happy with the deal.

If they finally go back to the Big East it really opens the door for UB.

but without UConn the AAC is not as attractive for men’s and women’s basketball...

6 hours ago, enrique14150 said:

In a purely cynical sense, everyone is trying to get as much money, at the highest level, as they can.  I understand that's ultimately what will drive things for most guys.  I want to believe there's more to it, but sometimes there isn't.  And sometimes it isn't spiteful, it's that an opportunity came up and they went for it. And in this world of college sports they're going to act on these motivations, and in the process burn some things. So yeah, I think I do.

I think the more to it exists in: hometowns and alma maters.

Lot of coaches go to coach at home and at their school and stay a long time. 

I'm on school #5 but I have a special place in my heart for UB, both my hometown and my first alma mater. All the others...cash and circumstance.

5 hours ago, Kevin said:

This was literally my point, but I was told I was angry with a vendetta and throwing a tantrum.  The funny part is I know coach B. I dont have anything PERSONAL against him. This is all business like we've said. His business decision was to fly to Alabama at the first possible chance. Alnutt has to make his counter move. 

But you nailed it.

I can tell you how the business works, but I can't make you understand