961819

Don’t worry guys, our better Kenpom ranking will win this one for us 

6 hours ago, dutchcountry7 said:

Your behavior is not acceptable.  It is sophomoric.  And it is indicative of someone who hasn't been in a position to make such decisions.  It is the worst of the Monday Morning Quarterbacking. 

Okay Wolfy lmao whatever you say 

6 hours ago, dutchcountry7 said:

If the only number that mattered was in the win column then Creighton wouldn't have accepted an invitation to the Big East and we wouldn't be wanting an invitation to the American.  Of course, wins aren't all that matter.  You can get wins by playing teams no one cares about.  But I am sure you'd be changing your tune if JW started scheduling more non-D1 games or low level D1 games.  You'd talk about how those wins don't matter and how he needs to go.  Broken record.

As I stated previously, your reading comprehension skills aren’t very good. Go ahead and look back at my comments. I said the wins in Cleveland count as well as the wins in the tournament, however I understand your reasoning for selectively picking and choosing certain lines to back up your flawed rhetoric. 

6 hours ago, BrooklynBull said:

All of these statistics going into all the computers are meaningless.  Computers do not play games.  People do.  The only real statistics is the won-loss record.   Keep this in mind over the next two plus weeks as you see stat after stat about the Super Bowl.

 

Here is the only stat that matters.  The team with the most points in the game is 54-0.  I will predict that when everyone goes to sleep after the game on February 7th that the team with the most points will be 55-0.

I wish I could like this multiple times 

7 hours ago, SGBull said:

I think there is a middle ground. Rankings do matter, wins and losses matter as well.

Weren't half the posters here making fun of Danny White for calling UCF national champions when they went undefeated?

If the only thing that mattered was wins and losses then the March Madness bracket would look a lot different every year because there are a lot of lower ranked teams that don't get in despite having very good W/L numbers.

I included Cleveland too, I agree with what you mean but at the end of the day if a team that’s ranked #6583737 on Kenpom wins the whole tournament then who the hell cares about their Kenpom ranking? Defending this underperforming coach by pointing out rankings isn’t acceptable. Where Oats left the program, we should’ve made an aggressive hire to keep the momentum rolling. Being fine with going from one of the top mid majors in the country to returning to where we were at the beginning of Oat’s tenure is laughable in my opinion. We should be taking steps forward and progressing and capitalizing, not repeating a cycle because then that would be we are capped and can’t get any better than the best we’ve ever been. I don’t do participation trophies or merit points because a coach is doing similar to how another did at the same point as the previous coach. You either lose your coach due to them doing really well and choose to capitalize on that success and launch yourself forward or you lose a coach due to underperforming and have to rebuild 

16 hours ago, dutchcountry7 said:

Why do we care about the performance of our college basketball team?  Why do we care how the program has performed in a thread where people are calling for a drastic change and a coach to be fired?

Seriously, it is pretty clear you have an agenda here and like to push disinformation.  

Yes, I love impartial third parties taking an objected look at things so that I can minimize my own biases.  You clearly not only prefer your biases but believe that you have all the answers.

It's behavior like yours that makes fan bases unbearable. 

No, my behavior is perfectly acceptable. However there are ulterior motives on your end as well. Rankings mean absolutely nothing. The only numbers that matter are the numbers in the win column and the numbers in the loss column. After these two numbers the only other number that matters is how many wins we get in Cleveland followed by wherever we play in the Dance. Go ahead and take comfort in your projected numbers and don’t at all be upset with the lack of momentum that could’ve been capitalized on after Oat’s departure.

27 minutes ago, dutchcountry7 said:

Okay, so this line struck me since I thought I must have been misremember if what you said were true.

But nope...

Stony Brook was #217 the next season (2017) and #223 the season after that (2018).  The team plummeted in a rebuild.  As is often the case when a coach is hired away.  We didn't have that because Whitesell brought stability to the program.

Stony Brook hasn't been good.  They have been bad with a few good years.  And on those rare occasions when they have been good, the fans have turned out.    

Jesus Christ you love numbers dude who the hell cares? We just lost to a team that was ranked worse than us the rankings don’t mean anything 

1 hour ago, dutchcountry7 said:

You're telling me that the game I linked to which posted video of the packed out arena as time expired with fans rushing the court was half empty at half time?

Is that because people went to the concession stand before they came back to watch the second half of the game?

There is literally video I posted that shows you're talking nonsense.  But hey, if you want to talk about all the games you go to at SBU, that kind of proves my point.  Even UB fans go to SBU games, then it must be a sleep giant.  They can even get you to games and your contention is that there is no reason anyone would watch SBU games.  You're the hardest critic to win over and they already won you over.  

You clearly can’t read very well. I WENT to SBU which is the only reason I would attend one of their games. That also was nowhere near the full capacity of that arena. I’m also in that video 

3 hours ago, dutchcountry7 said:

 

I will run over some points you made...

Location.  This is a selling point for Stony Brook.  They are near their most successful alumni base.  Teams from all over the country want to go to the NYC metro area to play games.  While playing in Long Island is likely not a big draw right now, it would be acceptable with a better brand.  They can draw teams to NYC.  They are a logical regional rival for UConn and Rutgers.  Being on Long Island is an advantage they have.  you speak about being a pro sports town but that is no different than Buffalo.  Buffalo has nothing to sell visiting teams on so they won't come to Buffalo for a game.  But go to NYC--no matter where the school is from--and they will be playing in front of alumni from that school.  NYC is home to alumni from everywhere.  Buffalo is not.

You speak of support for the program but by SBU's own admission they have only recently started to put work into their athletic programs.  They are absolutely further ahead than when we made the jump to FBS.  Their facilities, their fundraising, their student, community, and alumni support are ahead of where we were when we made the jump and they have a better path forward.  Yes, Buffalo is currently better than SBU.  That isn't the question.  They could make the jump to FBS though and they would see a boost from it. They have the tools to do it already.  That's the point.  They are no more or no less a B1G school than Buffalo.  A claim that is simply rhetoric since being a B1G school simply means being a member of the Big Ten Conference.  Some people around here seem to think Northwestern isn't a B1G school since they aren't a public school.  Which is honestly an absurd metric.  The only reason people want to emphasize the public feature is because they think it will ensure a built in fan base.

You talk about SBU's basketball success and how "your own two eyes" didn't see their fans turn out in their most successful season.  That is funny to me because 2016 was their big year.  So are you saying that you went to a regular season game in the only year they made the NCAA tournament and didn't see a lot of fans turn out?  You realize in 2016 we both made the big dance.  They finished the year #98 in KenPom and we finished #138--both of us got in by winning the conference tournament. They averaged 3,400 a game that year while we averaged 3,200 fans a game.

This is their support from one of their home games that season.  I guess it wasn't the game you "saw with your own two eyes" which is reasonable since not all the games were like that, just as not all our games are well attended.

 

Stony Brook is NOT where Buffalo is today and they would like to become Buffalo as far as athletic accomplishments are concerned.  But they are further along than Buffalo was when Buffalo made the leap to FBS.  And SBU has more advantages built in that would allow them to succeed if they made the jump.

Now back to talking about UB basketball...

You're upset about a loss and want to have the Top-25 team back.  Who doesn't?

But that doesn't mean that we should be talking about a coaching change.  First, people here act like it is easy to hire a good coach.  Every hire includes significant risk.  So you make the move when it is worth it.

We have to give the program time.  It is easy to be impatient and want a fresh start now but every fresh start is going to include volatility that resets the clock on the program being built.  The program is NOT in free fall as some make it out to be.  The metrics tell us that the program is stable, even if you're not happy.  

I get people long for the success of Oats' teams and that is understandable.  But he is gone for a reason.  He is lightyears better than a coach Buffalo can get.  He was a stop on the way up and finding many of those in sequence is hard to do.  But even he wasn't immune the loss we are talking about.  People seem to forget how his top-25 team lost to (#136) Northern Illinois and (#105) Bowling Green in the greatest season in Buffalo history.  But now people want to claim the sky is falling because our team losses to (#114) Kent State?

Give the program time.  We will have a better picture of the program in a year or two.  The program is in good shape.  Yes, we all want more out of it.  But the program is still one of the strongest mid-major programs in the country and still a top team in the MAC which is the goal to maintain.

 

I’m gonna let you in on a funny secret, well over half of that crowd left that game at halftime. Source: I was literally there. They may not have made the big dance after 2016 but they were still good and their coach was hired away as proof of that. Compare it to when UB was at their peak. Arena sold out every game, standing room only and well over doubled the attendance of SBU in their best year. You comparing UB to SBU is laughable and I wouldn’t be surprised if you never set foot on that campus. It’s completely a commuter school and is depressing. They are halfway out on Long Island so, no, they don’t have the NYC metro area draw. They’re in a quiet little Long Island town. I speak from experience and eyewitness to this, you speak from numbers. Those are not the same and don’t ever compare UB to SBU

Oh and there’s a very good reason why the activity of this fan board has declined since Oats left. I wonder why? 

2 hours ago, dutchcountry7 said:

Why do you say SBU isn't going FBS?  They are as well positioned to be FBS as Buffalo.  In fact, I would argue they are better positioned.  

I would take their stadium any day over UB Stadium.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_P._LaValle_Stadium#/media/File:LavalleHomecoming2019.jpg

It is a fairly arbitrary line people like to draw.  Carve it out so that Rice and Tulane aren't included.  Another slice to exclude UC-Irvine or in-state academic rival Stony Brook.  Another slice to ensure UMass, Ohio, and Miami are not included.  Cut up so that any metric fits the narrative that UB is a Big Ten school just the Big Ten hasn't figured it out yet.

The Big Ten is an athletic conference.  Buffalo doesn't fit in the athletic conference.

I am on board with the sentiment.  I believe Buffalo could be a big deal; much bigger than it is. And I already believe it is a pretty big deal.  But there is a lot of potential there.  

First we have to have an honest assessment of what it is.  The gimmicks to try to accelerate it by using PR campaigns to convince people it is further along doesn't work.  The strategies that are used are the same ones that every other G5 (or FCS looking to become FBS) is employing.  And that is exactly why it won't work and hasn't worked.

 

I’m going to stop you right there. I truly hope people read this and don’t selectively pick and choose lines from it to have opinions on. Also, admins- please do not alter this comment as it has no profanity and this is a discussion board for fans of the program to discuss the program. This will be a lengthy response. Also, dutchcountry, I’m not sure if you’re well-studied, making pure assumptions, or if you yourself are a staff member of one of the athletic programs but you listed some info in your responses that for us fans would be ....very hard info to come across through research. 
 

I went to Stony Brook at the beginning of my collegiate career. They are located in Long Island. If you are unaware, their proximity to New York City and its surplus of professional teams means that their (SBU’s) sports are supported less than local high school teams are. Their student sections are non-existent at games and the only game where there was a respectable sized one was homecoming... and even then, that was only because local fighter Chris Algieri was making an appearance at the game ahead of his fight with the legendary Manny Pacquiao. The best part? All of the students left at halftime. The school’s students have zero interest in their sports programs.
 

Stony Brook had a very nice run recently with their men’s basketball program. The result of which was them losing their coach through a PROMOTION to.....Ohio of the “prestigious” MAC conference. Nobody at SBU cared, and it got zero publicity. When they were at their peak, the arena didn’t sell out games and there were barely any students. (Source: my own two eyes).

 The UB men’s basketball program is coming off of the best season in its entire history, right after having its best season the season before that. They one-upped their best season ever with an even better one. That combination of seasons not only launched UB into the national spotlight, it led to its greatest coach ever being poached by Alabama. A move that, as a fan, I hated and felt like I got punched in the gut but simultaneously a promotion that he absolutely deserved. It shows with his current performance at Alabama. In addition to it making us one of the more relevant non-P5 programs, comparable to the SDSUs, BYUs, etc- it also showed the country and this fan base what this school is capable of. Nate Oats brought this program to heights that we could’ve only ever dreamed of. There were serious discussions about how the arena may have needed to be expanded if success like that continued. Coaching makes or breaks a team completely. Coach Calipari of Kentucky does not win National Titles despite having NBA farm team rosters every year. This is because he is a good recruiter and businessman but not a great coach. Nate Oats is both an excellent recruiter and fantastic coach. What did this school do to replace the loss of the best coach this school has ever had? They promoted from within. A move that in the past worked because the coach that got promoted was a legendary high school coach with a history of winning at the highest level. However the promotion from within wasn’t their young, star-in-the-making assistant coach Jamie Quarles. They hired a fantastic assistant coach with a lackluster history as a head coach. 
 

My point with this response is to point out that we have seen what this school is capable of athletically speaking. It’s fantastic and exciting. We have the size of the other flagship athletic schools in the country and have shown flashes of pure athletic potential. That momentum, which is CRUCIAL for a mid major program, is now dead. We have an athletic director that was fortunate enough to come in to a school that had 3 fantastic coaches already in place. (Leipold, Jack, and Oats) When it was time for him to do his job and continue the success, he did not execute. Keeping the roster together would have been a smart move if we weren’t graduating one of the most amazing senior classes in college basketball history. The fans on this board are frustrated. They have every right to be. I know life-long fans that in previous seasons would have donated a kidney to attend these games with the level they were playing at. These same fans sat through the Reggie era and continued to be die hard fans. Now they don’t want to pay the money to have a cut out picture of themself in the arena because they’re disheartened and upset with the direction the program has gone in. That is huge. 
 

We can list Kenpom ratings until our hands fall off but the reality of that is we got absolutely embarrassed by a team that was ranked worse than us by those same ratings. Our players are not executing, they don’t have energy, they play without structure and without discipline and that comes directly from the coach.

Not to be that guy but the refs are doing their best to keep it close 

Worth noting as well, Malik has been very optimistic lately and the team has stood by his side through the whole ordeal. He will have his chance to prove his innocence/self defense claim and if found that he acted in self defense fully expect him to be re-rostered as well 

Mr. Keishawn Brewton has had his waiver approved and is available immediately. Expect him to start tomorrow 

22 hours ago, BullBoy said:

At this level you can choose to put your money and resources into Football or basketball.  I feel like Danny White chose basketball and Allen rode the coattails of that.

Alnutt has made it clear we are a football school.  He was extremely cheap when it came to choosing a head coach and anyone that follows his twitter account can see he is more concerned about his Kansas City Chiefs than our men's basketball program.

Get rid of Alnutt and Whitesell, bring in an aggressive AD. Hire John Beilein 

I’m not going to say my opinion on what happened because I’ll get crucified for it on here but somethings gotta change 

1 minute ago, Erie County said:

Do we know why Bivens plays minutes? 

We really dont think Skogman can do more than Bivens? 

They play different positions and Savion has more fouls than points this season 

1 hour ago, BullBoy said:

It’s comical how clueless most of you are on this board. Did any of you do research on army before you trashed them or did you just decided they aren’t good because thats what you felt like?

did you know Army was 9.5 point favorites today? Did you know their average of victory this season was 41.5 points?

im not say UB played well, but you are making it seem like we lost to a youth team. 
 

when you play a service academy it’s all about discipline and they were more disciplined then us. 

First, UB was the favorite to win by a range of 9.5-11 points. Second, those “big wins” came against a non D1 opponent and a D1 opponent that may as well be a D2 team. Don’t call other fans on here clueless when one of your major talking points was incorrect.

If our starters can remain healthy and play like starters should plus getting the contribution from the bench players that we’ve gotten in this game we’ll do well this year. Maybe this game could be what Nickelberry needed to wake up 

4 minutes ago, SGBull said:

I found a low quality one. http://www.freesportsforall.ml/2020/11/army-west-point-vs-buffalo.html

Ran some quick diagnostics on that site, do not use that link unless you enjoy Trojan horse and root kit viruses lol 

5 minutes ago, Ivantheturrible said:

Haven’t seen much Mballa in the 2nd half, there a specific reason for that?

He seemed to be struggling a little 

11 minutes ago, DocCas86 said:

Maybe I missed - is Skogman unavailable today?

Skogman is available, but still adjusting to the D1 speed. Good offensively but a liability defensively 

UB grabs their 73rd O Board this game continuing where they left off last year 

Brock looks great out there. Also Towson realizes they have to grab rebounds right?

Stream quality is better than I expected. Commentators think Western Kentucky is in the MAC though 

On 11/24/2020 at 11:44 AM, Erie County said:

It wasn't a knife. 

It's been discussed as a "sharper" piece of broken gym equipment he used to defend himself

Thank you. 
 

One of the wooden chairs in the gym that had the leg snap off during the fight to be exact.