Chet Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 (edited) I always love the teams that Coach TK puts together, but if there is another team in the MAC that has choked more in Cleveland, let me know. Many great regular seasons and no NCAA tournaments. They haven't won the MAC since 1980. We played well in a loss in the first matchup at Alumni in January in front of a small crowd with no students. We have not won many recent games vs the top tier of the conference, but a win on the road at Toledo might begin to change the narrative of the season. We can only hope. Edited February 25, 2023 by Chet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocCas86 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 21 minutes ago, Chet said: I always love the teams that Coach TK puts together, but if there is another team in the MAC that has chocked more in Cleveland, let me know. Many great regular seasons and no NCAA tournaments. They haven't won the MAC since 1980. We played well in a loss in the first matchup at Alumni in January in front of a small crowd with no students. We have not won many recent games vs the top tier of the conference, but a win on the road at Toledo might begin to change the narrative of the season. We can only hope. Agree - winning today could help from a confidence perspective. As for Cleveland, my money is on either Akron or Kent. I just feel like defense wins when you get into conference championships. Toledo's offense likely gets them wins against UB, Ohio and Ball State, but Akron and Kent have enough offense and much better d than Toledo, tipping scales in their favor. To build upon this point, for UB to have a chance they will have to play better defense in Cleveland... they were talking d after the last game -- let's hope they continue that mentality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird96 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 24 minutes ago, Chet said: I always love the teams that Coach TK puts together, but if there is another team in the MAC that has chocked more in Cleveland, let me know. Many great regular seasons and no NCAA tournaments. They haven't won the MAC since 1980. We played well in a loss in the first matchup at Alumni in January in front of a small crowd with no students. We have not won many recent games vs the top tier of the conference, but a win on the road at Toledo might begin to change the narrative of the season. We can only hope. If UB plays like they did in the first matchup, there’s definitely hope. It’s sure to be a high scoring game but it’d be nice to see a similar effort on defense as the Bulls had vs CMU. Last time vs Toledo the stats were very even, Rockets just made a couple more 3’s and a little better % from inside the arc. See what happens today, go Bulls! 🤘 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big 4 Hoops Blogger Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 It's never easy to win on the road in the MAC. UB's first game against Toledo was competitive but I think it'll be much more difficult this afternoon. Hope I'm wrong and watch Buffalo come out strong! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big 4 Hoops Blogger Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 (edited) 22 minutes ago, DocCas86 said: Agree - winning today could help from a confidence perspective. As for Cleveland, my money is on either Akron or Kent. I just feel like defense wins when you get into conference championships. Toledo's offense likely gets them wins against UB, Ohio and Ball State, but Akron and Kent have enough offense and much better d than Toledo, tipping scales in their favor. To build upon this point, for UB to have a chance they will have to play better defense in Cleveland... they were talking d after the last game -- let's hope they continue that mentality. While I understand your reasoning, I'm not sure I completely agree. Kent doesn't have a good track record in Cleveland under Rob Senderoff either. I think winning the MAC Tournament is a combination of talent, getting hot at the right time and a little bit of luck. I've seen Ohio and Buffalo win the MAC Tournament seven times since I was a freshman at OU in 2009-10. Some of those teams were great but many just clicked when it mattered the most. While defense is certainly important, the reason Kent/Akron win at a high level is because they have quality offenses to go along with their defensive ability. Toledo is very average defensively but they are ELITE offensively, 14th in the nation in adjusted offensive efficiency. No one in the MAC can touch their offense. The issue for the Rockets is if they have an off night, they're vulnerable. That doesn't happen often though. At the current moment, I think there's five teams that have a shot at a run in Cleveland. Kent/Akron/Toledo are the favorites but Ball St. and Ohio could be sneaky. If UB wants to have any shot in the MAC Tournament, they'll need to continue their recent focus defensively like you mentioned. Edited February 25, 2023 by Big 4 Hoops Blogger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird96 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 9 minutes ago, Big 4 Hoops Blogger said: At the current moment, I think there's five teams that have a shot at a run in Cleveland. Kent/Akron/Toledo are the favorites but Ball St. and Ohio could be sneaky. Interesting to see UB’s defensive rankings in conference games are actually better than their offensive. That’s in conflict with the narrative we hear from ESPN’s announcers game in and game out which seems to be strictly based on the Bulls’ points for/against numbers. Either way, defense needs to continue improving down the stretch to have any chance of making some noise in Cleveland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 30 minutes ago, Big 4 Hoops Blogger said: While I understand your reasoning, I'm not sure I completely agree. Kent doesn't have a good track record in Cleveland under Rob Senderoff either. I think winning the MAC Tournament is a combination of talent, getting hot at the right time and a little bit of luck. I've seen Ohio and Buffalo win the MAC Tournament seven times since I was a freshman at OU in 2009-10. Some of those teams were great but many just clicked when it mattered the most. While defense is certainly important, the reason Kent/Akron win at a high level is because they have quality offenses to go along with their defensive ability. Toledo is very average defensively but they are ELITE offensively, 14th in the nation in adjusted offensive efficiency. No one in the MAC can touch their offense. The issue for the Rockets is if they have an off night, they're vulnerable. That doesn't happen often though. At the current moment, I think there's five teams that have a shot at a run in Cleveland. Kent/Akron/Toledo are the favorites but Ball St. and Ohio could be sneaky. If UB wants to have any shot in the MAC Tournament, they'll need to continue their recent focus defensively like you mentioned. Always spot on. Great post per usual. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big 4 Hoops Blogger Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bluebird96 said: Interesting to see UB’s defensive rankings in conference games are actually better than their offensive. That’s in conflict with the narrative we hear from ESPN’s announcers game in and game out which seems to be strictly based on the Bulls’ points for/against numbers. Either way, defense needs to continue improving down the stretch to have any chance of making some noise in Cleveland. That's a good point. A lot of people have this perception that UB's strength is on the offensive side of the court because of their quick tempo but the metrics don't back that up. Truth is, Buffalo is average on both sides of the court. Their defense is near the top of the conference during MAC play while their offense is closer to the bottom group of teams in the league. It's pretty easy to point out some of the problem areas for this squad when you look at their deeper numbers. Edited February 25, 2023 by Big 4 Hoops Blogger 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocCas86 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 2 hours ago, Big 4 Hoops Blogger said: While I understand your reasoning, I'm not sure I completely agree. Kent doesn't have a good track record in Cleveland under Rob Senderoff either. I think winning the MAC Tournament is a combination of talent, getting hot at the right time and a little bit of luck. I've seen Ohio and Buffalo win the MAC Tournament seven times since I was a freshman at OU in 2009-10. Some of those teams were great but many just clicked when it mattered the most. While defense is certainly important, the reason Kent/Akron win at a high level is because they have quality offenses to go along with their defensive ability. Toledo is very average defensively but they are ELITE offensively, 14th in the nation in adjusted offensive efficiency. No one in the MAC can touch their offense. The issue for the Rockets is if they have an off night, they're vulnerable. That doesn't happen often though. At the current moment, I think there's five teams that have a shot at a run in Cleveland. Kent/Akron/Toledo are the favorites but Ball St. and Ohio could be sneaky. If UB wants to have any shot in the MAC Tournament, they'll need to continue their recent focus defensively like you mentioned. Let me amend it a little. The differential between offensive and defensive efficiency I believe is most predictive. This will tell how well you do on average in your offensive possessions vs your opponent during their offensive possessions. The differential is similar for top 3 (Kent +12.4, Akron +13.3 and Toledo +15.2), but favors Toledo slightly. My theory which I need time to research is that being a better defensive team is a bit of an equalizer, as I think defense is more likely to be consistently there for the team in high pressure games like conference tournaments. I will research when I get a chance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 Three point defense is non existent for Bulls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird96 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 10 minutes ago, Chet said: Three point defense is non existent for Bulls. No doubt. Too many easy buckets inside too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, Erie County said: This is over. No defense from whitesell's team once again. You get a tone of heat on here, but it doesn't mean you are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird96 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 These lazy passes by the Bulls leading to turnovers….that’s two 3’s by Toledo now off turnovers. Big swing in pts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird96 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 3-Pt defense or not, Toledo isn’t missing from anywhere Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DooleyBull06 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Idk what everyone sees in our defense. It isn’t great. Nor is it lockdown. And lately it has been very bad. Forget numbers and metrics…what are your eyes telling you? My eyes tell me we don’t play complementary basketball. Our wild turnover prone offense leaves our defense vulnerable. We’ve been out rebounded a lot lately. Defense can’t make stops. And Jones disappears in big games. Everyone says, “Oh this team was just lights out against us.” Ask yourself this, is it a lucky day or just bad defense by the bulls? #Frustrated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BasketBull Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 This team reminds me a lot of some of Keno Davis’ CMU teams. Capable of winning a game they lead wire to wire but atrocious defense and completely incapable of overcoming any adversity whatsoever. It feels like if they go down 5 it’s over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 Just now, BasketBull said: This team reminds me a lot of some of Keno Davis’ CMU teams. Capable of winning a game they lead wire to wire but atrocious defense and completely incapable of overcoming any adversity whatsoever. It feels like if they go down 5 it’s over. Body language on court and bench isn't good at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DooleyBull06 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 What’s today’s excuse? Toledo shooting on bigger rims? This is pathetic. I understand we were/are a younger team compared to season’s past. I understand we need to grow and get familiar with one another bc this was a batch of new players but this team has regressed as the season has gone on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BasketBull Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 It’s not the fact that they aren’t top 4 in the league that bothers me. It’s the fact that they consistently look like they don’t even belong on the same court as the top four in the league that bothers me. Another 15+ point halftime deficit, why even bother? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird96 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 (edited) First 6 minutes or so were promising. Turning point of the half seemed to be at 11-11 when UB gave up an easy layup then threw the inbound pass right to Toledo who kicked it out for an open 3. Five point lead just like that. Not the kind of performance in the 1st to inspire any kind of confidence looking ahead. Edited February 25, 2023 by Bluebird96 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 Poor start to the 2nd half. We look completely lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire17 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Is this Toledo the same Toledo that beat the Griffs by 1 point? What is going on? Just a bad game from the Bulls, I hope. Because it’s all going to come together in Cleveland…led by Coast to Coast Powell! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tee4three Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Will be an interesting off season, have had a bunch of really bad defeats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire17 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Here’s the plan: Copy what Iowa did against Mich St today. Get this to within 13 points with 2 minutes to go. Then put on the afterburners and win it in OT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire17 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Has any team in any conference surrendered 35 and over 100 points in consecutive games? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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